Skate Sharpening deep or shallow hollow

[mnhcp]

the greatest goalie cut skate, is a 1"shallow at the center of the blade, moving to a 2" deeper cut on the heel and the toe of the skate. it works out perfect, and the shuffles are incredible.

The only thing that makes a goalie skate any better, is if you get an ODB (overdrive blade)

those things are sooo nicee! perfect slides and grip in a wide stance every time.

Interesting. How do they do the transition from a 1" to a 2"? Or is this just common knowledge.

[mnhcp]

These guys invented the "Quick Square".

http://www.maximumedge.ca/

Check their products list, I believe they have a new version that costs a little less.

There are a few shops that do a good job, most have some kid that doesn't have a clue what he/she is doing.

The average parent with a couple youngsters could buck up and buy a sharpener and be way ahead of the game by the time they graduate.

I would take an EZ-Sharp or a Blademaster anyday of the week over that Wissota machine...

On this site mentioned is the Quicksquare for Professional Use and the Skate Gauge for Personal Use. They both come w/ the magnetic angle per email from store.

Why not a Wissota as I'm thinking about buying a sharpener?

[Lily Braden]

the greatest goalie cut skate, is a 1"shallow at the center of the blade, moving to a 2" deeper cut on the heel and the toe of the skate. it works out perfect, and the shuffles are incredible.

The only thing that makes a goalie skate any better, is if you get an ODB (overdrive blade)

those things are sooo nicee! perfect slides and grip in a wide stance every time.

We're in the metro area. Is there a place you've taken your goalie skates in the cities that you've liked? Or someone specific who does a good job? And will a good sharpening somehow prevent a goalie from letting a puck in, 5-hole?

[2 for cheating]

[/quote]
On this site mentioned is the Quicksquare for Professional Use and the Skate Gauge for Personal Use. They both come w/ the magnetic angle per email from store.

Why not a Wissota as I'm thinking about buying a sharpener?[/quote]

I sent you a PM.

I don't want to bash any machines on here, but I feel there is a big difference.

[TPSKohoHockey29]

the greatest goalie cut skate, is a 1"shallow at the center of the blade, moving to a 2" deeper cut on the heel and the toe of the skate. it works out perfect, and the shuffles are incredible.

The only thing that makes a goalie skate any better, is if you get an ODB (overdrive blade)

those things are sooo nicee! perfect slides and grip in a wide stance every time.

Interesting. How do they do the transition from a 1" to a 2"? Or is this just common knowledge.

http://www.goaliestore.com/board/equipm ... d-cut.html
believe it now?

[mnhcp]

NEW QUESTION: Why is one skate sharpeners 1/2" inch hollow more evident then another? When comparing past sharpenings it appears one persons hollow is rounder and more obvious then another. Is this possible on the assumption the 1/2" setting is exactly correct both times. A friend said when he worked in a skate shop when he was younger that he "honed the stone" or "honed the wheel" after every 3 sharpenings otherwise the hollow wouldn't be deep enough OR did he possible mean the hollow wasn't round enough?

[elliott70]

ttt

[mnhcp]

NEW QUESTION: Why is one skate sharpeners 1/2" inch hollow more evident then another? When comparing past sharpenings it appears one persons hollow is rounder and more obvious then another. Is this possible on the assumption the 1/2" setting is exactly correct both times. A friend said when he worked in a skate shop when he was younger that he "honed the stone" or "honed the wheel" after every 3 sharpenings otherwise the hollow wouldn't be deep enough OR did he possible mean the hollow wasn't round enough?

Can someone take on this question? Thanks.

[Can't Never Tried]

NEW QUESTION: Why is one skate sharpeners 1/2" inch hollow more evident then another? When comparing past sharpenings it appears one persons hollow is rounder and more obvious then another. Is this possible on the assumption the 1/2" setting is exactly correct both times. A friend said when he worked in a skate shop when he was younger that he "honed the stone" or "honed the wheel" after every 3 sharpenings otherwise the hollow wouldn't be deep enough OR did he possible mean the hollow wasn't round enough?

Can someone take on this question? Thanks.

The hollow, or radius is applied by the wheel dresser, if set correctly 1/2" radius will be 1/2" there should be no difference in any machine.
If the wheel is dressed often (I re-dress the wheel for each skate) it should always be uniform.
Now lets say you only dress it every 3-5 pairs
Heres what occurs...
Lets say you dress the wheel for 1/2" and the skates you are sharpening were previously 5/8" or larger, you grind all that material out of the center to bring it to 1/2" all is good, but it wore down the center of the wheel, now the next guy is 3/8" but he wants 1/2 " too, so now your grinding away the edges of the hollow first...you get the picture.
All this time the wheel is actually breaking down in the areas getting the most contact, combine that with the fact some skates were poorly sharpened before and you may be grinding more off one edge then the other, breaking that side down even further.
So if you don't redress the wheel often, or at least each pair, you will get the result of what grinding several different blades does to the wheel, in fact you may not have a true radius at all anymore.
Hope that answers your question.

[mnhcp]

NEW QUESTION: Why is one skate sharpeners 1/2" inch hollow more evident then another? When comparing past sharpenings it appears one persons hollow is rounder and more obvious then another. Is this possible on the assumption the 1/2" setting is exactly correct both times. A friend said when he worked in a skate shop when he was younger that he "honed the stone" or "honed the wheel" after every 3 sharpenings otherwise the hollow wouldn't be deep enough OR did he possible mean the hollow wasn't round enough?

Can someone take on this question? Thanks.

The hollow, or radius is applied by the wheel dresser, if set correctly 1/2" radius will be 1/2" there should be no difference in any machine.
If the wheel is dressed often (I re-dress the wheel for each skate) it should always be uniform.
Now lets say you only dress it every 3-5 pairs
Heres what occurs...
Lets say you dress the wheel for 1/2" and the skates you are sharpening were previously 5/8" or larger, you grind all that material out of the center to bring it to 1/2" all is good, but it wore down the center of the wheel, now the next guy is 3/8" but he wants 1/2 " too, so now your grinding away the edges of the hollow first...you get the picture.
All this time the wheel is actually breaking down in the areas getting the most contact, combine that with the fact some skates were poorly sharpened before and you may be grinding more off one edge then the other, breaking that side down even further.
So if you don't redress the wheel often, or at least each pair, you will get the result of what grinding several different blades does to the wheel, in fact you may not have a true radius at all anymore.
Hope that answers your question.

Finally....I think we have the new definitive new Guide to Dummies on Skate Sharpening! You just completed the last chapter. Thank you.

[cclavin]

NEW QUESTION: Why is one skate sharpeners 1/2" inch hollow more evident then another? When comparing past sharpenings it appears one persons hollow is rounder and more obvious then another. Is this possible on the assumption the 1/2" setting is exactly correct both times. A friend said when he worked in a skate shop when he was younger that he "honed the stone" or "honed the wheel" after every 3 sharpenings otherwise the hollow wouldn't be deep enough OR did he possible mean the hollow wasn't round enough?

Can someone take on this question? Thanks.

The hollow, or radius is applied by the wheel dresser, if set correctly 1/2" radius will be 1/2" there should be no difference in any machine.
If the wheel is dressed often (I re-dress the wheel for each skate) it should always be uniform.
Now lets say you only dress it every 3-5 pairs
Heres what occurs...
Lets say you dress the wheel for 1/2" and the skates you are sharpening were previously 5/8" or larger, you grind all that material out of the center to bring it to 1/2" all is good, but it wore down the center of the wheel, now the next guy is 3/8" but he wants 1/2 " too, so now your grinding away the edges of the hollow first...you get the picture.
All this time the wheel is actually breaking down in the areas getting the most contact, combine that with the fact some skates were poorly sharpened before and you may be grinding more off one edge then the other, breaking that side down even further.
So if you don't redress the wheel often, or at least each pair, you will get the result of what grinding several different blades does to the wheel, in fact you may not have a true radius at all anymore.
Hope that answers your question.

Yep, the wheel 'flattens' out as you sharpen so the hollow becomes shallower. Not to mention the carbon that accumulates on the wheel, which can lead to some ugly looking blades and even some burning if one is not careful.

It's been a long time since I sharpened but I used the grinder only if the skates were new of they were in such bad shape (rust, really bad nicks, etc) we didn't want to ruin the wheel.

The worst days to sharpen skates were always right after Christmas, cheap Target skates for everyone!

[Blade-Tek]

Good Grief Folks - The CROSSGRIND is dead. If the shop you go to frequently subjects your skates to crossgrinding, my suggestion to you is to not return. Crossgrinding eats away your blade faster than anything else - simple as that. It is a great tool to assist in selling replacement blades. It does have some benefit when a blade is being profiled, and even then it is really not neccessary.

If you are looking for a machine for personal use, or for doing your kids skates over their upcoming hockey years, then the best bang for your buck is either the Wissota (approx $800), or the E-Z Sharp (approx $1300), whereas a single head Blademaster or Blackstone will cost you approx $4,000. With a little effort and practice the sharpen you produce will be no different coming off the $800 machine when compared to the $4000 machine.

Your Local Skate Sharpening Shop SHOULD:

• redress the sharpening wheel for each pair of skates
  ensure the blade is not bent
  grind to the radius of hollow that you choose or prefer
  ensure the hollow has at least a satin smooth finish (a mirror finish is preferable)
  after grinding, check each skate blade for level (even edges) using a quicksquare or other similar tool (HDI)
  finish with a hand hone to ensure any metal burring is gone

If your shop does not do at least the above, it may be time to look around for someone who does.

I sharpen a ton of skates every year, here is the reality - many goalies these days are going for a very deep hollow such as 3/8" (Kiprisof fans I guess). Others are happy with 5/8" or even 9/16". Actually there are no goalies that I do, that are going for the 7/8" or 1" hollows ? ? Go figure?

There now that I've said my piece I'm happy. I'm sure there will be skeptics - there always is. My many very loyal patrons are not among them.
www.blade-tek.com

[Bash Brother]

the greatest goalie cut skate, is a 1"shallow at the center of the blade, moving to a 2" deeper cut on the heel and the toe of the skate. it works out perfect, and the shuffles are incredible.

The only thing that makes a goalie skate any better, is if you get an ODB (overdrive blade)

those things are sooo nicee! perfect slides and grip in a wide stance every time.

Overdrive blades arent legal in HS hockey

[spin-o-rama]

1) Figure Skates are not cross ground. They are sharpened to the skater's ROH preference. Speed skates have no ROH, but are still sharpened.

2) It is possible for hockey skates to be sharpened uneven if figure skates were done right before. Figure skates have wider blades and if the holder is not lowered then a hockey skate will be sharpened off center.

3) Whether you have a shallow or deep hollow, properly sharpened edges will be sharp. Shallow does not equal dull. Deep hollow sharpenings will dull faster.

I am not familiar with Wissota, but I hear their wheel spins in the opposite direction (counter clockwise) making you pass the skate left to right.

As Blade-Tek mentioned, there are goalies (Kiprusoff) who are going very deep with their hollows instead of the traditional shallow goalie cut.

Many famous players use very deep or shallow hollows so a player should experiment with what works for them. Skate radius also plays a factor.

Paul Coffey used a 1-2" hollow. Gretzky used a 1/2 to 5/8" hollow. Local skating guru Barry Karns uses a shallower hollow.

Here is a fun article about skate sharpening, including what current Oilers use for ROH.

http://www.blademaster.ca/Skate_Sharpening_Tips.pdf

[niceice909]

haha i just tell the man to sharpen them and its great anything works for me but the guy who does it has been doing it for like 30 years and pros send there blades to get sharpened from him

[Blade-Tek]

NEW QUESTION: Why is one skate sharpeners 1/2" inch hollow more evident then another? When comparing past sharpenings it appears one persons hollow is rounder and more obvious then another. Is this possible on the assumption the 1/2" setting is exactly correct both times. A friend said when he worked in a skate shop when he was younger that he "honed the stone" or "honed the wheel" after every 3 sharpenings otherwise the hollow wouldn't be deep enough OR did he possible mean the hollow wasn't round enough?

Can someone take on this question? Thanks.

As a skate sharpener, I hate to admit it, but what occurs could be any or all of the following:
- very often in many shops they don't bother to actually provide you with your requested ROH, they nod say "Yeah Sure" and then proceed to sharpen at the hollow they have previously set
- differences in the calibration and accuracy of the radius mechanism & diamonds can vary greatly among manufactureres and individual shops.
- poor sharpening operator

There are many differences in sharpening wheels, most shops utilize a medium soft wheel (pink) however some have harder 'ceramic' wheels which require less honing in order to restore the radius.
Typically wheels should be re-honed often (personally I do this for every pair), but this drives up the operating costs and many high volume shops often use less frequent honing to reduce costs and to save $$$$$. Sad but true.

[Can't Never Tried]

Dressing the wheel more often is the key.
As far as cost savings Mehhh?
A wheel costs what for a pink one? less then $30.00, and it'll sharpen probably around 600 skates I believe.

Plus if you dress more often you don't have to remove as much each time, and the customer gets a better job done.

[tomASS]

Plus if you dress more often you don't have to remove as much each time, and the customer gets a better job done.

you're still talking about skating sharpening here right?

[Blade-Tek]

Most manufacturer's of sharpening wheels claim their stone will last for about 200 pair, as well as a diamond dresser lasting through two wheels. This is fairly accurate when the shop typically sharpens skates to their one specific ROH. (Very few people actually ever ask for a specific hollow - sad but true)
I receive a variety of puzzled looks from customers when I ask them which hollow they would like. . . most people have no idea what they need.
Since I dress or redress for each pair, my wheels have only ever lasted up to a maximum of 100 pair. I often have to re-dress from a 5/8" hollow to a 3/8" depending upon the customer's roh requests. Many high volume shops may have 2 or three machines with 2 finishing heads each, say 6 wheels on the go. . . 60 to 100 pair a day . . . . the profit difference can be and is huge.
Take a few minutes next time you drop skates off and if you are able to view the sharpening in progress, just see how many pair receive a fresh dressing - you may be surprised.