10U playing time...

[Relax, It's Just A Game]

Just curious what the opinions are on this...

10U team with 17 players, they have been assigned positions since day one (with 2 individual changes so far). 10 forwards, 5 defensemen, 2 goalies. The goalies rotate each game. The 5 defensemen have turned into 4 with a injury and normally get equal shifts. The 10 forwards are a first and second line with 3 and the third line has 4 (4 least skilled players on the team).

The 4 girls on the third line rotate amongst themselves, meaning one misses her turn on that line's first shift and usually gets one shift in the first period and two in the second period. I'll get to the third period in a bit.

Now if there's a power play or a penalty things change, the unit is composed of the first or second line and the third line sits. The periods always start with either the first or second line on the ice.

In the third period the bench usually gets shortened with the third line usually missing a shift here and there if the game is within a couple of goals which most games have been. Today for example, with a minute and twenty seconds remaining, this team is up 3-1... the third line was headed on the ice for a faceoff in their own zone after long shift by the second line. The faceoff turned into a quick shot by the opposing team and the goalie held the puck for a whistle which took a total of about 12 seconds off the clock. Bench doors open and out comes the first line to finish the game.

This team is winning 26% of their games so far and have played over 10 but under 20 games.

Practices are usually more of the same with the lines wearing different colored jersey's and the defense have a color of their own. First and second lines recieve a bit more instruction and one of them are always on the ice to start a particular drill along with the defense while the third line waits their turn.

By now you probably assume I'm a parent of a child on that third line which is correct. Tonight my daughter seen the ice a total of 4 shifts including the last 12 second one. I can't get past the fact that these girls are mostly 9 years old (a few are 8,a few are 10) and the skill level really isn't that different amongst them. A couple players are certainly better, a couple are certainly more physical and aggresive, but it seems to me like the 3 coaches that are on the bench are handling this team terribly wrong. Their approach goes against everything I've heard and read as far as player development at this age. The team has no unity, when the first and second line's are out the girls all try to get the puck to a chosen few and when the third line is out the defense takes it upon themselves to step up and carry the puck into the zone and try to make something happen. Not to mention the fact that these coaches have decided who's going to be defensemen and who's going to be forwards for their careers. At this point I would of rather seen cuts made than to have to explain to my daughter why she continually gets shuffled to the back of the line on the bench. The thought of cutting girls on a 10U team sounds ridiculous but then I would of had to tell her only once why she isn't good enough instead of after each game.


Don't get me wrong, I'm not one of those parents who thinks every kid deserves a trophy and I like to win games as well. Maybe if this teams record was reversed and they were winning you could tell me this is helping our program, but the way things are going I think they're doing very little to help the program. 10U being coached like a varsity team? Please tell me I'm wrong...

[royals dad]

U10 should not have PP or PK and should be on a regular rotation. If there is an off number like 10 forwards they should not have set lines.

I think you should try and have a dialog with the team manager, the coaches and if all else fails the association. There are always different sides to the story and I'm sure the coach would have some things to say about this situation but it is plain and simple at this age you don't do this.

I would say that working girls into positions for the year is something that I can see a bit more, but even there unless the player is absolute about what they want to do they should still rotate up or back some. Even the goalies should be skating out from time to time.

Is this U10 A or B?

[mnhcp]

Hopefully it's just a communication issue?

Set an appointment to talk to the coach. It amazes me the number of parents who do not speak to their coaches about concerns and not assuming you're one of those. They wait until the parent surveys to throw them under the bus.

Doesn't matter if 10UA or 10UB, it's still developmental and all kids should be playing D and F positions. No locking in on forwards or D's. You can never get a perfect balance as you also have to balance the teams morale. Maybe if you spoke to the coach he has a plan to rotate them halfway through the season?

Most associations have an "equal play for equal effort rule". Read your clubs manual and address it with the coach. Read your district rule book on Penalty Kills as our district doesn't allow power play lines at the 10U level. The loop hole is "effort". We utilize the this loop hole for the kids who don't show up for practices ie effort. They don't play as much.

[T3]

Our association has it written in the by-laws that at the U10/Squirt level there is not PP or PK and that all players will get equal playing time.
I agree that you should talk to the coach first but if things do not change you should talk to someone in your association.

[The Bone]

Most associations have an "equal play for equal effort rule". Read your clubs manual and address it with the coach. Read your district rule book on Penalty Kills as our district doesn't allow power play lines at the 10U level. The loop hole is "effort". We utilize the this loop hole for the kids who don't show up for practices ie effort. They don't play as much.

Much like the quote above, I think most assoc. have similar rules/recomendations for U10/squirt levels.

Development & learning the objectives of this level
Equal play time as best possible
No Power Play Units
No Penalty Kill Units
No Short Bench
Ussually equally skilled lines
Some allow power lines in the last few min. of a game or period

CLEARLY - Your coaching staff has it wrong for the U10 Level

Other have given good advice, visit with the coach in a positive constructive manner.

[nickel slots]

Is this U10 A or B?

No offense, RD, but I think this question epitomizes a lot of the issues the exist out there. The same could be said of the question "Boys or girls?" The reason? Either way, we're talking about 9-11 year old kids and focus should be on skill development and team building (making the child feel like they're an important part of something). I can see where a coach might throw his best players out there with 2 or less minutes left in a tournament game, but anything other than that is nothing more than a coach that has his intentions set on winning... and he's probably lost sight on what's important. It's an easy trap to fall in to.

I see another flaw in this coach's system... 15 skaters... does anybody else see any reason to do anything other than 3 sets of lines and 3 sets of d? Can anybody complain about playing time if there are 3 equal lines that all play equally?

I think you should talk to this coach. He more than likely had a parent meeting at the beginning of the year to communicate his philosophy of the game. If he said he wants to focus on developing the girls, hold him to it.

[royals dad]

The reason I asked about A or B is that if this is an A team, this might be a good situation to move down to B and get a better situation for this player. I agree that it should not matter at U10 they should have the same philosophy A or B but for this parent they need to try and get thier daughter into the best fit.

As a coach and parent myself I can tell you nothing beats a good open dialog with the coach. Don't say anything in the stands that you won't say direct to the coach but if that doesn't work maybe check in with your associations player rep or board about next steps. The coach went through CEP training which clearly states (if your discription is correct) he/she is going in the wrong direction and that U10 teams need to be run for developement. This is why we don't rank or have state tournaments at this level.

Everyone who has been around sports has seen this situation but I have also seen it turned around, when the coach and the parents talk (not argue). Unfortunatley if they do change this coach will probably here from the "top" kids parents about why he/she is throwing games by not using the top kids in some situation. So they will be inbetween a rock and a hard place either way. The right thing for the coach regardless is to focus on making all 17 players on this team improve and leave the season wanting to come back for the next.

[nickel slots]

The reason I asked about A or B is that if this is an A team, this might be a good situation to move down to B and get a better situation for this player.

Makes sense now.

[royals dad]

"No offense, RD"

None taken we are in vilolent agreement

Just wanted to advise that they might look to move down if possible and from my experience more often than not I see Squirt and U10 "A" coaches who run teams this way.

[Relax, It's Just A Game]

Thanks for all the advice and comments. I wish we didn't have a youth girls forum just yet so more people could see this. I think it could apply to all youth sports for that matter.

I have started a dialogue with the coaches this morning but I wrote this post last night.

There is no B team at the 10U level in this association.

[Whatthe]

RIJAK you are not wrong. Unbelievable way to rotate kids at that level. These types of stories make you cring.

[fun&games]

RIJAG what was the outcome of your conversation with the coach?

[OntheEdge]

Just curious what the opinions are on this...

10U team with 17 players, they have been assigned positions since day one (with 2 individual changes so far). 10 forwards, 5 defensemen, 2 goalies. The goalies rotate each game. The 5 defensemen have turned into 4 with a injury and normally get equal shifts. The 10 forwards are a first and second line with 3 and the third line has 4 (4 least skilled players on the team).

The 4 girls on the third line rotate amongst themselves, meaning one misses her turn on that line's first shift and usually gets one shift in the first period and two in the second period. I'll get to the third period in a bit.

Now if there's a power play or a penalty things change, the unit is composed of the first or second line and the third line sits. The periods always start with either the first or second line on the ice.

In the third period the bench usually gets shortened with the third line usually missing a shift here and there if the game is within a couple of goals which most games have been. Today for example, with a minute and twenty seconds remaining, this team is up 3-1... the third line was headed on the ice for a faceoff in their own zone after long shift by the second line. The faceoff turned into a quick shot by the opposing team and the goalie held the puck for a whistle which took a total of about 12 seconds off the clock. Bench doors open and out comes the first line to finish the game.

This team is winning 26% of their games so far and have played over 10 but under 20 games.

Practices are usually more of the same with the lines wearing different colored jersey's and the defense have a color of their own. First and second lines recieve a bit more instruction and one of them are always on the ice to start a particular drill along with the defense while the third line waits their turn.

By now you probably assume I'm a parent of a child on that third line which is correct. Tonight my daughter seen the ice a total of 4 shifts including the last 12 second one. I can't get past the fact that these girls are mostly 9 years old (a few are 8,a few are 10) and the skill level really isn't that different amongst them. A couple players are certainly better, a couple are certainly more physical and aggresive, but it seems to me like the 3 coaches that are on the bench are handling this team terribly wrong. Their approach goes against everything I've heard and read as far as player development at this age. The team has no unity, when the first and second line's are out the girls all try to get the puck to a chosen few and when the third line is out the defense takes it upon themselves to step up and carry the puck into the zone and try to make something happen. Not to mention the fact that these coaches have decided who's going to be defensemen and who's going to be forwards for their careers. At this point I would of rather seen cuts made than to have to explain to my daughter why she continually gets shuffled to the back of the line on the bench. The thought of cutting girls on a 10U team sounds ridiculous but then I would of had to tell her only once why she isn't good enough instead of after each game.


Don't get me wrong, I'm not one of those parents who thinks every kid deserves a trophy and I like to win games as well. Maybe if this teams record was reversed and they were winning you could tell me this is helping our program, but the way things are going I think they're doing very little to help the program. 10U being coached like a varsity team? Please tell me I'm wrong...

All I can say is that what you describe is inappropriate. As a former Board member of an association, any U10 or squirt coach that didn't play his players equally would be counseled by our board to change his or her approach. Squirt and U10 are strictly developmental levels. It is very unusual for a U10 team to have PK or PP lines. I think everyone is pretty much in agreement on this at the Squirt/U10 level. It gets a little dicey when you move up to the U12 and U14 levels. I think most people are more foregiving when a coach plays lines unequally when playoffs start. In playoffs a coach might roll all 3 lines but have a PK and PP and maybe give the first line more ice time when the playoff game is close. In our association unequal play is discouraged at all levels.

[Relax, It's Just A Game]

Thanks for the comments,

Let me start by saying the best advice posted here is when you have situations your concerned about you need to contact the coaches and more than likely they will take the time to listen. I did that and had a great conversation with the coaches and they certainly listened to my opinions. Without getting into too much detail let me just say that our families situation has gotten better and my daughter continues to have fun as a member of this team. My original post was one side of the story and of course there is the other side of it which you haven't heard.

My main concern is the level of competitiveness these younger ages are experiencing. I think alot of us parents are in such a hurry for these kids to grow up and forget the fact that their just kids having fun playing a game. I read over on the boys side about having a Squirt State Trny? When is it enough? You will have a very hard time convincing me that the kids at that level would have more fun at a State Trny than they would at any other games. I would like to make the arguement they would have just as much fun taking a weekend off and doing something other than hockey as a team. Ice fishing, sledding, bowling, etc. etc. Their just kids! It's easy to forget when their on the ice but when they come off and get out of all there hockey gear do you see how young they are?

Their going to grow up fast enough. These kids will have alot of games ahead of them at the higher levels where we'll need to worry about Wins and Losses and long road trips. Stop trying to rekindle your hockey goals and accomplishments thru your kids. If they are the next Wayne Gretzky, the next Michael Jordan, or the next Joe Mauer they will be discovered and they will get more limelight than you ever wanted or imagined. The fact is most of them won't ever see the ice on their Varsity team. We as parents have to stop stealing their youth.

[OntheEdge]

Thanks for the comments,

Let me start by saying the best advice posted here is when you have situations your concerned about you need to contact the coaches and more than likely they will take the time to listen. I did that and had a great conversation with the coaches and they certainly listened to my opinions. Without getting into too much detail let me just say that our families situation has gotten better and my daughter continues to have fun as a member of this team. My original post was one side of the story and of course there is the other side of it which you haven't heard.

My main concern is the level of competitiveness these younger ages are experiencing. I think alot of us parents are in such a hurry for these kids to grow up and forget the fact that their just kids having fun playing a game. I read over on the boys side about having a Squirt State Trny? When is it enough? You will have a very hard time convincing me that the kids at that level would have more fun at a State Trny than they would at any other games. I would like to make the arguement they would have just as much fun taking a weekend off and doing something other than hockey as a team. Ice fishing, sledding, bowling, etc. etc. Their just kids! It's easy to forget when their on the ice but when they come off and get out of all there hockey gear do you see how young they are?

Their going to grow up fast enough. These kids will have alot of games ahead of them at the higher levels where we'll need to worry about Wins and Losses and long road trips. Stop trying to rekindle your hockey goals and accomplishments thru your kids. If they are the next Wayne Gretzky, the next Michael Jordan, or the next Joe Mauer they will be discovered and they will get more limelight than you ever wanted or imagined. The fact is most of them won't ever see the ice on their Varsity team. We as parents have to stop stealing their youth.

I agree a State Tourney for U10/Squirts is a bad idea and I'm sure that the people at Mn Hockey would probably agree. Minnesota Hockey/USA Hockey realizes that there is too much emphasis on games and not enough on fun and development. Unfortunately MH/USA Hockey is in a bind. If they put in too many rules, parents will find other venues. For example, there are places like MN Made that offer an alternative to USA Hockey sanctioned hockey. I think MH if pushed will cave to the parents wishes because they want their membership to be happy and paying their dues.

I have a very fond memory of my daughter's U10A coach. Before the season started he stated that all of the kids would play equally. He said that U10A was not about winning but about development and that kids need to learn and have confidence that they can play in any situation. I was skeptical because you hear such statements a lot but when its crunch time something different usually occurs, however, in our first tourney my daughter, who at the time was a new defensive player and wasn't the most confident kid, was put in a 5-3 PK in a tournament championship game even though she wasn't a top D. She loved it and it set the tone for the rest of the season. I give him a lot of credit for developing the players on that team, many of which have the confidence to play varsity hockey now.

[royals dad]

"Let me start by saying the best advice posted here is when you have situations your concerned about you need to contact the coaches and more than likely they will take the time to listen. I did that and had a great conversation with the coaches and they certainly listened to my opinions."

This should be a sticky!