Selects 17 Minnesota Hockey Failed us!

[eastend]

USA Hockey is ruining the game. They are controlling every level except college and pro. And by the recent college commitments if you arent involved with their programs you dont have a chance there either. <p></p><i></i>

[blackeye]

Mr. Emgasser???<br><br>I think that if you asked the kids that have made the Mn team, or the lucky few that have made the National team and gotten to participate in international competition they would probably not agree with your opinion about the Select process. For someone that has always steered clear, and always thought it was a joke, you sure have a lot of anger about it.<br><br>Your son is lucky to have a scholarship, why don't you teach him a lesson about being mature. <br><br>Good thing you saved those $50 fees for the tryouts...I'm sure that helped with the HS tuition.<br><br>There are always plenty of people here ready to rip on USA Hockey and MAHA, and they have for the most part many legitimate complaints. I just wonder how many of these loudmouths actually step up and volunteer their time and work their way into the organizations to try to get things changed........ <p></p><i></i>

[eq8r]

How sad that this has become so political. Even the coaches who dedicate their time in coaching these Select 16/17's don't have the input that they should. My son made the final 51's as a 16 and had a 100% better tryout at 17's. We were even told by the coach that he was ranked in the top 4 forwards on his team at the 17 tryouts (their team took 3rd place, not that it matters). He didn't make it onto the final 51's (or should I say 54). Go figure. I've given up trying to figure it all out. I've dubbed it the MMPBS. I'll let you figure it out, but the last two letters are self explainatory. <br><br>Minnesota Hockey should make this whole selection process an invite only at all leves, 15, 16, & 17 because we all know they already have those teams picked before the brochure is even posted on their website. <br> <p></p><i></i>

[pokecheck]

I would also like the kids to have some input.<br>I have asked my son about some of the selections and he usually comments that certain players are very easy to move off the puck while others are rock solid.<br>Some of his comments about the goalies are very interesting and definitley don't match up with who was selected.<br>The bracketed tourney format also needs to change because it is apparent that winning is still more important than trying to showcase players abilities. <p></p><i></i>

[Chieftan]

I'm sure i'll get hammered for this because some coaches in the selects process won't appreciate my comments, but. I've been coaching in the select 15's for a couple of years and have made this observation. It seems to me that winning has become more important than showcasing the players for a few. When I was asked to coach one of the first things I was told was to play the kids fair! No double shifting, matching lines etc. Run the lines straight up, coach the kids, evaluate and rank the players, that's it. I've seen coaches go completely against this for the sake of winning or maybe it's just me.<br><br>I'm a little naive to the final process so I really can't comment. In a long winded way I wanted to support Pokechecks final point.<br><br>Selects does not make or break a players career and maybe the program isn't perfect but I enjoy being a part of it as a coach. I do feel that some kids who otherwise wouldn't get noticed to benefit.<br><br>I know this thread was about 17's, sorry. <p></p><i></i>

[m4hockey]

<br>I don't know where you're getting Emgasser (which is Engasser) because his kid's going to Yale and they don't give scholarships. I think Selects is political - my kid tried out every year except his last because he finally figured it out. He never made the final team, and by his senior h.s. year the Gophers were seriously looking at him, but he committed to a different D1 school because he didn't want to wait around for the Gophers, losing out on another opportunity. <p></p><i></i>

[blackeye]

I know that, and you know that.<br><br>But, a bragging and ranting father might get confused.<br><br>He gave his kids' measurements, and there are not any other kids that big who are commited to colleges for 04 or 05 that are that big. It was kind of easy to figure out. <p></p><i></i>

[synergy44]

schools like yale definitely help out with financial aid, there is no way they could recruit a lot of kids for the cost of those schools........i think the select process is becoming more and more political each year, w/ this years 17's being one of the most politically picked teams i've seen..... <p></p><i></i>

[Dimona1964]

It would be difficult to imagine that politics does not to some degree enter into the Selects process, just as it would be diificult to be so naive to believe that politics doesn't enter into virtually any substantial organization, including youth hockey associations. IT WOULD ALSO BE HARD TO BELIEVE THAT POLITICS HAS NEVER EFFECTED THE BEHAVIOR OF THOSE ON THIS BOARD WHO SEEM TO HAVE A NEED TO PUBLICLY COMPLAIN ABOUT IT...<br><br>All 3 of my sons & my daughter have been "negatively" effected by politics at one point or another, as both my wife and I were when we were growing up. One way to look at it is as a learning opportunity. My opinion is that the best route to take is to make sure your sons and daughters understand that life can be unfair and downright nasty, and that they will benefit as adults by handling disappointment in certain ways rather than others. They and their parents can sulk and get angry, and blame this and that without offering or devising any positive self-accountable response (much like today's democrats). They can just go away. Or, they can channel their anger and/or disappointment in a positive way by vowing to and by working harder and achieving whatever it is that they are being told that they are not deserving of.<br><br>To claim that the Selects does not help those selected is irrational. A player can be selected and then not perform well, in which case he or she does not necessarily help themselves. A player cannot be selected, but the overwhelming number of those can still create visibility for themselves in any number of ways if they pursue their dreams, and perform at Model or in HS Elite (to name just two paths available). If a player deserves it <!--EZCODE BOLD START--><strong>and makes the required effort</strong><!--EZCODE BOLD END-->, they will get noticed no matter where they play.<br><br><!--EZCODE UNDERLINE START--><span style="text-decoration:underline">ANY</span><!--EZCODE UNDERLINE END--> selectee who performs well at Selects nat'l camps & festivals is helped <!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em><!--EZCODE UNDERLINE START--><span style="text-decoration:underline"><!--EZCODE BOLD START--><strong>TREMENDOUSLY</strong><!--EZCODE BOLD END--></span><!--EZCODE UNDERLINE END--></em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--> by Selects from most any aspect that you would wish to discuss. If they stay on course with their skills and game, exposure from Selects pays SIGNIFICANT dividends. But, if they subsequently falter by lack of work ethic, drugs, etc., they may as well frame the printout of the Selects roster PDF, because they will need to read about the selectees who remained commited and worked hard, and the non-selectees who put in similar efforts and passed them by. Bottom line: Selects tremendously helps those who deserve it and take advantage of the opportunity it affords. <br><br><br><br> <p></p><i></i>

[packerboy]

'64, I agree with much of your post but to say that people who question the benefits of being involved in Selects are being irrational is a little over the top. <br><br>Again, my only direct experience with selects is in baseball and as I've said: It was fun, met some nice people, played some top level ball; will do it again if selected, but to say that the select experience is going to put my son in any difererent a place than he would otherwise be is an assumption I and other rational people are not willing to make.<br><br>Nobody who is a select or elite proponent can offer any tangible proof to the benefits. There arent any long term studies or surveys to show that players of equal dedication and skill who didnt play selects are left behind those that did. <br><br>There are only few players selected, do the rest have no hope?<br><br>Again, I dont have any problem with having the programs but when they are sold as something that will greatly benefit development, there can be some discussion. <p></p><i></i>

[eq8r]

Yes, everyone is subject to politics in every aspect of life and MN Hockey's Select process is equally guilty. It's all life's lessons. <br><br>The beef here has nothing to do with the very talent players who deserve to make that team or any other high level team. The beef is that MN Hockey promotes the development of players....period. NOT the development of the TOP 20 players in the state. Then they solicite the rest of us to foot the bill! This whole process should be by invite only. Invite only those top kids who actually have a chance at making the final 20 team.....narrow it down to only 3 or 4 teams to determine the final 51 (or should I say "54") and do a round robin instead of a full 8 team tournament. No set lines, just "next 3 forwards, next 2 D, etc......heck, don't even keep score. Narrow the next group down to 40 or 30 instead of 51 (or however many they decided this year). Then they can really get a good look at which kids deserve to be on these teams. You can't tell me that they get a chance to look at 160 kids fairly. Over 3/4 of those players are "fill-in players" footing the bill. <br><br>Another "issue" I've noticed is that it seems like the kids from the North (or should I say "Out-State") don't get a fair shake. Look at the rosters and see how many kids north of say, Hinckley make it onto these "special" teams? MN Hockey should be representing ALL of MN, not just the Twin Cities & surrounding areas. <p></p><i></i>

[eq8r]

Did anyone happen to notice that this topic must have cause a lot of grief to MN Hockey because they pulled the Select 17 list off their website. Also at the 15's level, that list has not yet been posted. There's some big surprises there with some top kids who didn't make the camp. <p></p><i></i>

[hcky0809]

I would have to agree with you. Alot of people have been anxiously awaiting to see the Select 15s list and all indications have been that there have definitely been some surprises both ways. I happened to over hear a parent the other night who's son is going to St. Cloud and he said he was embarrassed about it because he knew of other players that did not make it that did better than his son and he definitely did not think the best 102 players were going to St. Cloud. I think we all realize that no system is ever perfect in evaluating players but you can only hope that it is still within a reasonable percentage of questionable decisions. <p></p><i></i>

[balls]

ovechkin is an 85 he did not play in that tourney <p></p><i></i>