ESPN at Hermantown Hibbing game?

[pekyman]

It's fine if kids/parents want to open enroll at Hermantown for hockey, but getting all these players from a metro area of 150,000 people means that they should be in AA.

By your definition, everyone in the twin cities metro should be AA.

And, why not include "bedroom" communities like Orono and Delano that are no farther from downtown Minneapolis than AA teams like St. Michael and Lakeville/Farmington? A town like Orono benefits from a growing upper middle class (to upper crust) influx of people who like the small town feel and a great education system, yet commute only a short drive for work in the "twin cities" area? The average income levels and real estate values within 15-20 minutes of the 494/694 loop aren't exactly what people remember from a decade or more ago.

How about Mahtomedi? Great school system. In the metro. Consistently a top A program. Should be AA?

Either fight to move back to a single class system, to change the definitions of the current classes, or quit whining. It's an imperfect system, but it's what's in place.

I think King Rainier should be the one to decide what class a MN HS hockey teams play in as he seems to be such an expert on this matter - not.

Mahtomedi sits in a metro area of 3.3 million, The school is just a few students shy of AA enrollment, not much free lunch and has a bigger youth association than Hermantown does.

What about Breck also in a metro area of 3.3 million. Breck has actually won in 2009, 2010 and 3rd in 2012 and 2013 and will most likely be back this year?

O wait i forgot, neither of those teams stand in hibbing's way to get to state. Rainier you should get a life.

[SFA1992]

i mean you could make a case for Breck and Mahtomedi to opt up, too. I know i'd like to see them up there. It just takes two of them to move up, i feel like that would force the other's hand.

[rainier]

It's fine if kids/parents want to open enroll at Hermantown for hockey, but getting all these players from a metro area of 150,000 people means that they should be in AA.

By your definition, everyone in the twin cities metro should be AA.

And, why not include "bedroom" communities like Orono and Delano that are no farther from downtown Minneapolis than AA teams like St. Michael and Lakeville/Farmington? A town like Orono benefits from a growing upper middle class (to upper crust) influx of people who like the small town feel and a great education system, yet commute only a short drive for work in the "twin cities" area? The average income levels and real estate values within 15-20 minutes of the 494/694 loop aren't exactly what people remember from a decade or more ago.

How about Mahtomedi? Great school system. In the metro. Consistently a top A program. Should be AA?

Either fight to move back to a single class system, to change the definitions of the current classes, or quit whining. It's an imperfect system, but it's what's in place.

Should Plante quit whining about metro privates? The Hermantown coach whined like crazy about what the metro private did/are doing, but now that Hermantown is getting so many kids from outside Hermantown, they are in the same boat, but he thinks they are "where they belong". Is it unreasonable to ask that he apply the same criteria to his team that he does to others?

As soon as any Class A team develops to the point of being at least a top 15 AA team every year, then they should opt up, whether they are metro Mahtomedi or boonies TRF. This year, Hermantown is a heavy favorite to reach their 8th A title game in the last 10 years. I think they're ready to go to AA.

Also, I see some Mahtomedi youth teams are now AA. I wonder if this means they are planning to go AA at the HS level, or if they are copying the Hermantown model of playing AA at youth, then stepping down to A for HS?

Is Karl at your house pointing a shotgun at you, forcing you to read all the "whining" posts about Hermantown? If not, then feel free to not read them and it won't bother you anymore.

[rainier]

It's fine if kids/parents want to open enroll at Hermantown for hockey, but getting all these players from a metro area of 150,000 people means that they should be in AA.

By your definition, everyone in the twin cities metro should be AA.

And, why not include "bedroom" communities like Orono and Delano that are no farther from downtown Minneapolis than AA teams like St. Michael and Lakeville/Farmington? A town like Orono benefits from a growing upper middle class (to upper crust) influx of people who like the small town feel and a great education system, yet commute only a short drive for work in the "twin cities" area? The average income levels and real estate values within 15-20 minutes of the 494/694 loop aren't exactly what people remember from a decade or more ago.

How about Mahtomedi? Great school system. In the metro. Consistently a top A program. Should be AA?

Either fight to move back to a single class system, to change the definitions of the current classes, or quit whining. It's an imperfect system, but it's what's in place.

I think King Rainier should be the one to decide what class a MN HS hockey teams play in as he seems to be such an expert on this matter - not.

Mahtomedi sits in a metro area of 3.3 million, The school is just a few students shy of AA enrollment, not much free lunch and has a bigger youth association than Hermantown does.

What about Breck also in a metro area of 3.3 million. Breck has actually won in 2009, 2010 and 3rd in 2012 and 2013 and will most likely be back this year?

O wait i forgot, neither of those teams stand in hibbing's way to get to state. Rainier you should get a life.

Peky, we are all still waiting for you to provide any reasons for Hermantown staying in A other than their enrollment being A sized, which is the same argument STA made all those years. As I recall, you weren't buying that excuse when STA was using it. Why did you want STA out of A? Was it because they stood in your way of trophies? You sure were able to find time away from your "life" to give STA people crap back then.

I see a lot of other people on this forum saying Hermantown should opt up, and none of them are Hibbing fans, so what is their motivation? Could it be that they also want Hermantown to stop trophy-chasing and start playing against the teams they play at the youth levels? I am easily the loudest critic of Hermantown, but I am far, far from being the only one.

Hermantown would have been the #1 seed in 7AA last year and would be again this year, and even in their "bad" years they would be no worse than the #3 seed in 7AA. Is that not good enough for you?

[stromboli]

It's fine if kids/parents want to open enroll at Hermantown for hockey, but getting all these players from a metro area of 150,000 people means that they should be in AA.

By your definition, everyone in the twin cities metro should be AA.

And, why not include "bedroom" communities like Orono and Delano that are no farther from downtown Minneapolis than AA teams like St. Michael and Lakeville/Farmington? A town like Orono benefits from a growing upper middle class (to upper crust) influx of people who like the small town feel and a great education system, yet commute only a short drive for work in the "twin cities" area? The average income levels and real estate values within 15-20 minutes of the 494/694 loop aren't exactly what people remember from a decade or more ago.

How about Mahtomedi? Great school system. In the metro. Consistently a top A program. Should be AA?

Either fight to move back to a single class system, to change the definitions of the current classes, or quit whining. It's an imperfect system, but it's what's in place.

Should Plante quit whining about metro privates? The Hermantown coach whined like crazy about what the metro private did/are doing, but now that Hermantown is getting so many kids from outside Hermantown, they are in the same boat, but he thinks they are "where they belong". Is it unreasonable to ask that he apply the same criteria to his team that he does to others?

As soon as any Class A team develops to the point of being at least a top 15 AA team every year, then they should opt up, whether they are metro Mahtomedi or boonies TRF. This year, Hermantown is a heavy favorite to reach their 8th A title game in the last 10 years. I think they're ready to go to AA.

Also, I see some Mahtomedi youth teams are now AA. I wonder if this means they are planning to go AA at the HS level, or if they are copying the Hermantown model of playing AA at youth, then stepping down to A for HS?

Is Karl at your house pointing a shotgun at you, forcing you to read all the "whining" posts about Hermantown? If not, then feel free to not read them and it won't bother you anymore.

So now your definition is top 15 AA every year? By that definition, only Hermantown makes the cut.

Breck isn't a top 15 team every year, nor is Mahtomedi.

And, as soon as the top team, or two, or three opts up, then isn't another team likely to become a perennial "top" team?

I'm not bothered by your posts at all, so I'll keep reading. However, you do seem bothered by anyone who challenges your point of view. I'm simply trying to understand how your definition of who should be A vs AA would apply beyond Hermantown -- which is clearly what bothers you.

[pekyman]

By your definition, everyone in the twin cities metro should be AA.

And, why not include "bedroom" communities like Orono and Delano that are no farther from downtown Minneapolis than AA teams like St. Michael and Lakeville/Farmington? A town like Orono benefits from a growing upper middle class (to upper crust) influx of people who like the small town feel and a great education system, yet commute only a short drive for work in the "twin cities" area? The average income levels and real estate values within 15-20 minutes of the 494/694 loop aren't exactly what people remember from a decade or more ago.

How about Mahtomedi? Great school system. In the metro. Consistently a top A program. Should be AA?

Either fight to move back to a single class system, to change the definitions of the current classes, or quit whining. It's an imperfect system, but it's what's in place.

I think King Rainier should be the one to decide what class a MN HS hockey teams play in as he seems to be such an expert on this matter - not.

Mahtomedi sits in a metro area of 3.3 million, The school is just a few students shy of AA enrollment, not much free lunch and has a bigger youth association than Hermantown does.

What about Breck also in a metro area of 3.3 million. Breck has actually won in 2009, 2010 and 3rd in 2012 and 2013 and will most likely be back this year?

O wait i forgot, neither of those teams stand in hibbing's way to get to state. Rainier you should get a life.

Peky, we are all still waiting for you to provide any reasons for Hermantown staying in A other than their enrollment being A sized, which is the same argument STA made all those years. As I recall, you weren't buying that excuse when STA was using it. Why did you want STA out of A? Was it because they stood in your way of trophies? You sure were able to find time away from your "life" to give STA people crap back then.

I see a lot of other people on this forum saying Hermantown should opt up, and none of them are Hibbing fans, so what is their motivation? Could it be that they also want Hermantown to stop trophy-chasing and start playing against the teams they play at the youth levels? I am easily the loudest critic of Hermantown, but I am far, far from being the only one.

Hermantown would have been the #1 seed in 7AA last year and would be again this year, and even in their "bad" years they would be no worse than the #3 seed in 7AA. Is that not good enough for you?

In my opinion there is a big difference between a public and private school. I think it would be a good idea for all privates to move to AA.

STA actually won the tourney 4 times back to back before they moved. HT has not won since 2007.

I think if they can win it this year then a move to AA in 2017-18 season may be a good thing. I would really like them to win it as they have had some a few excruciating losses in that tourney. Especially the last one with STA. That was robbery. Still hurts today.

[SFA1992]

By your definition, everyone in the twin cities metro should be AA.

And, why not include "bedroom" communities like Orono and Delano that are no farther from downtown Minneapolis than AA teams like St. Michael and Lakeville/Farmington? A town like Orono benefits from a growing upper middle class (to upper crust) influx of people who like the small town feel and a great education system, yet commute only a short drive for work in the "twin cities" area? The average income levels and real estate values within 15-20 minutes of the 494/694 loop aren't exactly what people remember from a decade or more ago.

How about Mahtomedi? Great school system. In the metro. Consistently a top A program. Should be AA?

Either fight to move back to a single class system, to change the definitions of the current classes, or quit whining. It's an imperfect system, but it's what's in place.

Should Plante quit whining about metro privates? The Hermantown coach whined like crazy about what the metro private did/are doing, but now that Hermantown is getting so many kids from outside Hermantown, they are in the same boat, but he thinks they are "where they belong". Is it unreasonable to ask that he apply the same criteria to his team that he does to others?

As soon as any Class A team develops to the point of being at least a top 15 AA team every year, then they should opt up, whether they are metro Mahtomedi or boonies TRF. This year, Hermantown is a heavy favorite to reach their 8th A title game in the last 10 years. I think they're ready to go to AA.

Also, I see some Mahtomedi youth teams are now AA. I wonder if this means they are planning to go AA at the HS level, or if they are copying the Hermantown model of playing AA at youth, then stepping down to A for HS?

Is Karl at your house pointing a shotgun at you, forcing you to read all the "whining" posts about Hermantown? If not, then feel free to not read them and it won't bother you anymore.

So now your definition is top 15 AA every year? By that definition, only Hermantown makes the cut.

Breck isn't a top 15 team every year, nor is Mahtomedi.

And, as soon as the top team, or two, or three opts up, then isn't another team likely to become a perennial "top" team?

I'm not bothered by your posts at all, so I'll keep reading. However, you do seem bothered by anyone who challenges your point of view. I'm simply trying to understand how your definition of who should be A vs AA would apply beyond Hermantown -- which is clearly what bothers you.

agree here. in that sense, breck is sort-of in no mans land. I still think they, along with Hermantown, should be in AA. The reasons for Mahtomedi moving up have been laid out on here.

In a perfect world you end up with Hermantown and Breck moving up. It would make for better viewing in their respective sections, add even more flavor to regular season games, improve the parity in single A at the X. it makes for better hockey and i don't really think that's something that can be debated.

[rainier]

By your definition, everyone in the twin cities metro should be AA.

And, why not include "bedroom" communities like Orono and Delano that are no farther from downtown Minneapolis than AA teams like St. Michael and Lakeville/Farmington? A town like Orono benefits from a growing upper middle class (to upper crust) influx of people who like the small town feel and a great education system, yet commute only a short drive for work in the "twin cities" area? The average income levels and real estate values within 15-20 minutes of the 494/694 loop aren't exactly what people remember from a decade or more ago.

How about Mahtomedi? Great school system. In the metro. Consistently a top A program. Should be AA?

Either fight to move back to a single class system, to change the definitions of the current classes, or quit whining. It's an imperfect system, but it's what's in place.

Should Plante quit whining about metro privates? The Hermantown coach whined like crazy about what the metro private did/are doing, but now that Hermantown is getting so many kids from outside Hermantown, they are in the same boat, but he thinks they are "where they belong". Is it unreasonable to ask that he apply the same criteria to his team that he does to others?

As soon as any Class A team develops to the point of being at least a top 15 AA team every year, then they should opt up, whether they are metro Mahtomedi or boonies TRF. This year, Hermantown is a heavy favorite to reach their 8th A title game in the last 10 years. I think they're ready to go to AA.

Also, I see some Mahtomedi youth teams are now AA. I wonder if this means they are planning to go AA at the HS level, or if they are copying the Hermantown model of playing AA at youth, then stepping down to A for HS?

Is Karl at your house pointing a shotgun at you, forcing you to read all the "whining" posts about Hermantown? If not, then feel free to not read them and it won't bother you anymore.

So now your definition is top 15 AA every year? By that definition, only Hermantown makes the cut.

Breck isn't a top 15 team every year, nor is Mahtomedi. I've never called for Mahtomedi to opt up, and Breck would be top 15 in AA often enough where they should move up. They have several titles and continue to be top 3 in A almost every year. I think they would do fine in AA.

And, as soon as the top team, or two, or three opts up, then isn't another team likely to become a perennial "top" team? You tell me. Who would that be? Is there a team in A that is #3 or #4 every year? I don't think there would be. Do you? And who would that be?

I'm not bothered by your posts at all, so I'll keep reading. However, you do seem bothered by anyone who challenges your point of view. I'm simply trying to understand how your definition of who should be A vs AA would apply beyond Hermantown -- which is clearly what bothers you.

Of course I seem bothered by anyone who challenges my point of view, because I think it is insane that Hermantown stays in A. You're entitled to your point of view, and I am entitled to tell you I think it is insane that anyone would defend a team that does the following:

-Plays AA at youth, then steps down for HS.
-Plays a mostly AA HS schedule, but steps down to A for the playoffs.
-Can easily compete with the good AA programs, but stays in A.
-Be a suburb in the 2nd largest metro area in MN, yet call themselves "small town hockey".
-Routinely pound on the other teams northern teams that opt up to AA, yet continue to take the easy path by staying in A.
-Use the copious amounts of winning that comes from staying in A as an player attractant that decimates surrounding programs.
-"Whines" like crazy about STA and Breck, yet thinks it's fine to do the exact same thing themselves.
-Not follow the lead of other northern teams like Hibbing, Greenway, GR, Cloquet, Marshall, Bemidji, and Roseau who all have or are still opting up to AA because they know they can compete in AA.

I am glad that you are not bothered by my posts at all, and that you will keep reading.

[rainier]

Should Plante quit whining about metro privates? The Hermantown coach whined like crazy about what the metro private did/are doing, but now that Hermantown is getting so many kids from outside Hermantown, they are in the same boat, but he thinks they are "where they belong". Is it unreasonable to ask that he apply the same criteria to his team that he does to others?

As soon as any Class A team develops to the point of being at least a top 15 AA team every year, then they should opt up, whether they are metro Mahtomedi or boonies TRF. This year, Hermantown is a heavy favorite to reach their 8th A title game in the last 10 years. I think they're ready to go to AA.

Also, I see some Mahtomedi youth teams are now AA. I wonder if this means they are planning to go AA at the HS level, or if they are copying the Hermantown model of playing AA at youth, then stepping down to A for HS?

Is Karl at your house pointing a shotgun at you, forcing you to read all the "whining" posts about Hermantown? If not, then feel free to not read them and it won't bother you anymore.

So now your definition is top 15 AA every year? By that definition, only Hermantown makes the cut.

Breck isn't a top 15 team every year, nor is Mahtomedi.

And, as soon as the top team, or two, or three opts up, then isn't another team likely to become a perennial "top" team?

I'm not bothered by your posts at all, so I'll keep reading. However, you do seem bothered by anyone who challenges your point of view. I'm simply trying to understand how your definition of who should be A vs AA would apply beyond Hermantown -- which is clearly what bothers you.

agree here. in that sense, breck is sort-of in no mans land. I still think they, along with Hermantown, should be in AA. The reasons for Mahtomedi moving up have been laid out on here.

In a perfect world you end up with Hermantown and Breck moving up. It would make for better viewing in their respective sections, add even more flavor to regular season games, improve the parity in single A at the X. it makes for better hockey and i don't really think that's something that can be debated.

I agree that the A tourney would be greatly improved as there would be more parity, but I also think many people miss the other side of the coin, which is how much better AA could be if teams that could compete would opt up.

How much better would Semifinal Saturday at Amsoil be if it were Hermantown instead of Elk River? Wouldn't an East-Hermantown 7AA final cause the city of Duluth to shut down? The Xcel crowd went bonkers cheering for East last year when they took on Edina. Can you imagine how that place would erupt if it was Hermantown taking down a metro powerhouse? Picture what a Hermantown-STA AA final would be like, with 18,000 people rooting for the Hawks in prime time.

I think most AA fans are happy that BSM and STA are in AA. It improves the overall talent level and adds more intrigue to the yearly story lines.

We'll never have a one class tourney again, but we can come awfully close if teams would opt up when it makes sense. This is why I have said I wished Hibbing would have opted up for this year and next. They would have been the #4 seed in 7AA this year and I think they would be at least the #3 seed next year, with a puncher's chance of getting to state.

How cool would it have been to see EGF at the AA tourney the last two years? I don't begrudge any team for staying in A when they don't have a ton of A success already behind them, but it would have been a great storyline and I think they would have done fine at the tourney. How nuts would the Xcel have gone for those Hanowski-led Little Falls teams? How about an Oshie-led Warroad team? If you're going to have to get past a AA-caliber team at state, then why not do it while actually in AA instead of against a sandbagging A team?

[green4]

Won't Mahtomedi soon cross over the enrollment limit and become AA? Or is that school at max capacity?

[rainier]

I think King Rainier should be the one to decide what class a MN HS hockey teams play in as he seems to be such an expert on this matter - not.

Mahtomedi sits in a metro area of 3.3 million, The school is just a few students shy of AA enrollment, not much free lunch and has a bigger youth association than Hermantown does.

What about Breck also in a metro area of 3.3 million. Breck has actually won in 2009, 2010 and 3rd in 2012 and 2013 and will most likely be back this year?

O wait i forgot, neither of those teams stand in hibbing's way to get to state. Rainier you should get a life.

Peky, we are all still waiting for you to provide any reasons for Hermantown staying in A other than their enrollment being A sized, which is the same argument STA made all those years. As I recall, you weren't buying that excuse when STA was using it. Why did you want STA out of A? Was it because they stood in your way of trophies? You sure were able to find time away from your "life" to give STA people crap back then.

I see a lot of other people on this forum saying Hermantown should opt up, and none of them are Hibbing fans, so what is their motivation? Could it be that they also want Hermantown to stop trophy-chasing and start playing against the teams they play at the youth levels? I am easily the loudest critic of Hermantown, but I am far, far from being the only one.

Hermantown would have been the #1 seed in 7AA last year and would be again this year, and even in their "bad" years they would be no worse than the #3 seed in 7AA. Is that not good enough for you?

In my opinion there is a big difference between a public and private school. I think it would be a good idea for all privates to move to AA.

STA actually won the tourney 4 times back to back before they moved. HT has not won since 2007.

I think if they can win it this year then a move to AA in 2017-18 season may be a good thing. I would really like them to win it as they have had some a few excruciating losses in that tourney. Especially the last one with STA. That was robbery. Still hurts today.

Peky, losing 4 title games to teams that were/are even worse Class A abusers than Hermantown is not an excuse for staying in A. Being a top two team in Class A for a decade is more than enough reason to opt up.

But I do agree it would be a good thing for Hermantown to go to AA. Yes, they may not make it to state every year or they may lose in the AA tourney QFs, but they will always be competitive. That's why it sucks Plante passed on opting up a few years ago; last year's and this year's Hawks are both top 5 AA caliber teams, and next year's team would have been too if those kids hadn't left for Marshall, which could have been avoided if Hermantown was AA. Going AA will keep kids from leaving, will probably attract even more kids, and will shut everyone up about them being in A.

Yes, I am more motivated to criticize Hermantown because they stand in the way of Hibbing, but also because they stand in the way of Virginia, Greenway, Denfeld, and even Eveleth from getting to state and boosting their programs.

And what really drives me nuts is that if Hibbing or Greenway was as good as Hermantown, I can 100% guarantee they would be in AA. There is no way I can believe that being a dominant A team is better than being a very good AA team. Give me a QF loss to Edina at the AA tourney over a title game loss to Breck in the A tourney any day.

[pekyman]

Peky, we are all still waiting for you to provide any reasons for Hermantown staying in A other than their enrollment being A sized, which is the same argument STA made all those years. As I recall, you weren't buying that excuse when STA was using it. Why did you want STA out of A? Was it because they stood in your way of trophies? You sure were able to find time away from your "life" to give STA people crap back then.

I see a lot of other people on this forum saying Hermantown should opt up, and none of them are Hibbing fans, so what is their motivation? Could it be that they also want Hermantown to stop trophy-chasing and start playing against the teams they play at the youth levels? I am easily the loudest critic of Hermantown, but I am far, far from being the only one.

Hermantown would have been the #1 seed in 7AA last year and would be again this year, and even in their "bad" years they would be no worse than the #3 seed in 7AA. Is that not good enough for you?

In my opinion there is a big difference between a public and private school. I think it would be a good idea for all privates to move to AA.

STA actually won the tourney 4 times back to back before they moved. HT has not won since 2007.

I think if they can win it this year then a move to AA in 2017-18 season may be a good thing. I would really like them to win it as they have had some a few excruciating losses in that tourney. Especially the last one with STA. That was robbery. Still hurts today.

Peky, losing 4 title games to teams that were/are even worse Class A abusers than Hermantown is not an excuse for staying in A. Being a top two team in Class A for a decade is more than enough reason to opt up.

But I do agree it would be a good thing for Hermantown to go to AA. Yes, they may not make it to state every year or they may lose in the AA tourney QFs, but they will always be competitive. That's why it sucks Plante passed on opting up a few years ago; last year's and this year's Hawks are both top 5 AA caliber teams, and next year's team would have been too if those kids hadn't left for Marshall, which could have been avoided if Hermantown was AA. Going AA will keep kids from leaving, will probably attract even more kids, and will shut everyone up about them being in A.

Yes, I am more motivated to criticize Hermantown because they stand in the way of Hibbing, but also because they stand in the way of Virginia, Greenway, Denfeld, and even Eveleth from getting to state and boosting their programs.

And what really drives me nuts is that if Hibbing or Greenway was as good as Hermantown, I can 100% guarantee they would be in AA. There is no way I can believe that being a dominant A team is better than being a very good AA team. Give me a QF loss to Edina at the AA tourney over a title game loss to Breck in the A tourney any day.

You are absolutely wrong about why those brothers went to Marshall. Had absolutely nothing to do with Marshall moving to AA.
Once again, you really do not know anything about Hermantown.

[warriors41]

So now your definition is top 15 AA every year? By that definition, only Hermantown makes the cut.

Breck isn't a top 15 team every year, nor is Mahtomedi.

And, as soon as the top team, or two, or three opts up, then isn't another team likely to become a perennial "top" team?

I'm not bothered by your posts at all, so I'll keep reading. However, you do seem bothered by anyone who challenges your point of view. I'm simply trying to understand how your definition of who should be A vs AA would apply beyond Hermantown -- which is clearly what bothers you.

agree here. in that sense, breck is sort-of in no mans land. I still think they, along with Hermantown, should be in AA. The reasons for Mahtomedi moving up have been laid out on here.

In a perfect world you end up with Hermantown and Breck moving up. It would make for better viewing in their respective sections, add even more flavor to regular season games, improve the parity in single A at the X. it makes for better hockey and i don't really think that's something that can be debated.

I agree that the A tourney would be greatly improved as there would be more parity, but I also think many people miss the other side of the coin, which is how much better AA could be if teams that could compete would opt up.

How much better would Semifinal Saturday at Amsoil be if it were Hermantown instead of Elk River? Wouldn't an East-Hermantown 7AA final cause the city of Duluth to shut down? The Xcel crowd went bonkers cheering for East last year when they took on Edina. Can you imagine how that place would erupt if it was Hermantown taking down a metro powerhouse? Picture what a Hermantown-STA AA final would be like, with 18,000 people rooting for the Hawks in prime time.

I think most AA fans are happy that BSM and STA are in AA. It improves the overall talent level and adds more intrigue to the yearly story lines.

We'll never have a one class tourney again, but we can come awfully close if teams would opt up when it makes sense. This is why I have said I wished Hibbing would have opted up for this year and next. They would have been the #4 seed in 7AA this year and I think they would be at least the #3 seed next year, with a puncher's chance of getting to state.

How cool would it have been to see EGF at the AA tourney the last two years? I don't begrudge any team for staying in A when they don't have a ton of A success already behind them, but it would have been a great storyline and I think they would have done fine at the tourney. How nuts would the Xcel have gone for those Hanowski-led Little Falls teams? How about an Oshie-led Warroad team? If you're going to have to get past a AA-caliber team at state, then why not do it while actually in AA instead of against a sandbagging A team?

I get what you're saying, but I don't think those teams opting up makes the AA state tournament better necessarily. I think it would mainly just improve the section tournaments. One of the examples you used, Warroad's 2005 team, would have had to play Moorhead in the section tournament to get to state. When they played as both top ranked teams in the regular season the two teams tied. If Warroad was AA that year, the tournament would have only seen one of those top 2 teams go to state. With how both teams were classified, people got exposure to both teams which is valuable.

Its really a matter of perspective. If your goal is to see as many great hockey teams get the tournament as possible, then this system actually works pretty well and could work better if we limited opt ups. If your goal is to improve the section tournaments and ensure more parity in the A tournament, what your suggesting would be best.

[InYourFace09]

Peky just wants everyone in the top 5 to move to AA then the Hawks can finally win one, then Plante retires, and everyone is graced with the Hawks moving up to AA!!!

Problem solved.

[rainier]

In my opinion there is a big difference between a public and private school. I think it would be a good idea for all privates to move to AA.

STA actually won the tourney 4 times back to back before they moved. HT has not won since 2007.

I think if they can win it this year then a move to AA in 2017-18 season may be a good thing. I would really like them to win it as they have had some a few excruciating losses in that tourney. Especially the last one with STA. That was robbery. Still hurts today.

Peky, losing 4 title games to teams that were/are even worse Class A abusers than Hermantown is not an excuse for staying in A. Being a top two team in Class A for a decade is more than enough reason to opt up.

But I do agree it would be a good thing for Hermantown to go to AA. Yes, they may not make it to state every year or they may lose in the AA tourney QFs, but they will always be competitive. That's why it sucks Plante passed on opting up a few years ago; last year's and this year's Hawks are both top 5 AA caliber teams, and next year's team would have been too if those kids hadn't left for Marshall, which could have been avoided if Hermantown was AA. Going AA will keep kids from leaving, will probably attract even more kids, and will shut everyone up about them being in A.

Yes, I am more motivated to criticize Hermantown because they stand in the way of Hibbing, but also because they stand in the way of Virginia, Greenway, Denfeld, and even Eveleth from getting to state and boosting their programs.

And what really drives me nuts is that if Hibbing or Greenway was as good as Hermantown, I can 100% guarantee they would be in AA. There is no way I can believe that being a dominant A team is better than being a very good AA team. Give me a QF loss to Edina at the AA tourney over a title game loss to Breck in the A tourney any day.

You are absolutely wrong about why those brothers went to Marshall. Had absolutely nothing to do with Marshall moving to AA.
Once again, you really do not know anything about Hermantown.

Didn't Flaherty give an interview where he said he discussed going AA with those kids? I think it was the first interview he gave last year when they announced. I could be wrong, but I thought for sure he said so.

You think it was a coincidence that the first time Hermantown has ever lost players to Marshall just happened to be the year Marshall announced their opt up to AA? C'mon, pek.

I'd like to believe you Peky, but every time you tell someone they are full of BS, they go on to give really specific information about something that makes Hermantown look bad, such as Froggy or Jeffy95 pointing out all the open enrollees. I know you don't want the world to find out that the kids on the Hermantown Squirt A team come from seven different associations, but people get tired of the "small town hockey" sham, so they give a reality check. (I don't think even STA ever drew from that many associations! )

You are the one who said a few years ago that Hermantown doesn't allow open enrollment, and I believed you and that was why I defended Hermantown so much against the STA people. But now there are articles in the Duluth newspaper talking about the rampant open enrollment in Hermantown, and that it's been going on for a while. Thus, you were either lying or uninformed when you said they didn't allow open enrollment, and neither makes you look good when you're telling other people to shut up because they "do not really know anything about Hermantown".

Some people on here say things about Plante/Hermantown that is way worse than anything I've ever said, yet you say nothing to them. But, when myself, Froggy, Jeffy95, etc. start telling the truth about how many transfers are at Hermantown and how well they do against top AA teams at youth levels, that's when you get super angry and lash out.

What are you hiding?

[rainier]

agree here. in that sense, breck is sort-of in no mans land. I still think they, along with Hermantown, should be in AA. The reasons for Mahtomedi moving up have been laid out on here.

In a perfect world you end up with Hermantown and Breck moving up. It would make for better viewing in their respective sections, add even more flavor to regular season games, improve the parity in single A at the X. it makes for better hockey and i don't really think that's something that can be debated.

I agree that the A tourney would be greatly improved as there would be more parity, but I also think many people miss the other side of the coin, which is how much better AA could be if teams that could compete would opt up.

How much better would Semifinal Saturday at Amsoil be if it were Hermantown instead of Elk River? Wouldn't an East-Hermantown 7AA final cause the city of Duluth to shut down? The Xcel crowd went bonkers cheering for East last year when they took on Edina. Can you imagine how that place would erupt if it was Hermantown taking down a metro powerhouse? Picture what a Hermantown-STA AA final would be like, with 18,000 people rooting for the Hawks in prime time.

I think most AA fans are happy that BSM and STA are in AA. It improves the overall talent level and adds more intrigue to the yearly story lines.

We'll never have a one class tourney again, but we can come awfully close if teams would opt up when it makes sense. This is why I have said I wished Hibbing would have opted up for this year and next. They would have been the #4 seed in 7AA this year and I think they would be at least the #3 seed next year, with a puncher's chance of getting to state.

How cool would it have been to see EGF at the AA tourney the last two years? I don't begrudge any team for staying in A when they don't have a ton of A success already behind them, but it would have been a great storyline and I think they would have done fine at the tourney. How nuts would the Xcel have gone for those Hanowski-led Little Falls teams? How about an Oshie-led Warroad team? If you're going to have to get past a AA-caliber team at state, then why not do it while actually in AA instead of against a sandbagging A team?

I get what you're saying, but I don't think those teams opting up makes the AA state tournament better necessarily. I think it would mainly just improve the section tournaments. One of the examples you used, Warroad's 2005 team, would have had to play Moorhead in the section tournament to get to state. When they played as both top ranked teams in the regular season the two teams tied. If Warroad was AA that year, the tournament would have only seen one of those top 2 teams go to state. With how both teams were classified, people got exposure to both teams which is valuable.

Its really a matter of perspective. If your goal is to see as many great hockey teams get the tournament as possible, then this system actually works pretty well and could work better if we limited opt ups. If your goal is to improve the section tournaments and ensure more parity in the A tournament, what your suggesting would be best.

Yes, I would like to see more parity in the A tournament, at least closer to what usually happens at the AA tournament.

I just think about how fun it would be to root for Warroad in the AA tourney. If you have a solid shot at winning the AA section you would be in, then why not? I'd rather go to state in AA than win state in A. I don't think Roseau would trade their AA consolation title from a few years ago for a Class A title.

What's funny about the idea of limiting opt-ups is that the A tournament wouldn't change at all. It would still be Hermantown playing against a metro private like BSM, STA, or Hill Murray. In fact, the QFs would be worse as 3A and 1A would really get blasted if they had to play HM or BSM. (I assume they would move a good metro private to 5A.) I think we've all had enough of watching metro privates win the A tourney.

Another issue is that people treat opting up like it's a limb amputation. It is only a two year commitment; it's not a forever commitment. Move up when you feel like you can make some noise in the section you would be in for AA, and then move back down when that great class or two passes through. I don't get why the idea of opting back down to A is so taboo.

[pekyman]

Peky, losing 4 title games to teams that were/are even worse Class A abusers than Hermantown is not an excuse for staying in A. Being a top two team in Class A for a decade is more than enough reason to opt up.

But I do agree it would be a good thing for Hermantown to go to AA. Yes, they may not make it to state every year or they may lose in the AA tourney QFs, but they will always be competitive. That's why it sucks Plante passed on opting up a few years ago; last year's and this year's Hawks are both top 5 AA caliber teams, and next year's team would have been too if those kids hadn't left for Marshall, which could have been avoided if Hermantown was AA. Going AA will keep kids from leaving, will probably attract even more kids, and will shut everyone up about them being in A.

Yes, I am more motivated to criticize Hermantown because they stand in the way of Hibbing, but also because they stand in the way of Virginia, Greenway, Denfeld, and even Eveleth from getting to state and boosting their programs.

And what really drives me nuts is that if Hibbing or Greenway was as good as Hermantown, I can 100% guarantee they would be in AA. There is no way I can believe that being a dominant A team is better than being a very good AA team. Give me a QF loss to Edina at the AA tourney over a title game loss to Breck in the A tourney any day.

You are absolutely wrong about why those brothers went to Marshall. Had absolutely nothing to do with Marshall moving to AA.
Once again, you really do not know anything about Hermantown.

Didn't Flaherty give an interview where he said he discussed going AA with those kids? I think it was the first interview he gave last year when they announced. I could be wrong, but I thought for sure he said so.

You think it was a coincidence that the first time Hermantown has ever lost players to Marshall just happened to be the year Marshall announced their opt up to AA? C'mon, pek.

I'd like to believe you Peky, but every time you tell someone they are full of BS, they go on to give really specific information about something that makes Hermantown look bad, such as Froggy or Jeffy95 pointing out all the open enrollees. I know you don't want the world to find out that the kids on the Hermantown Squirt A team come from seven different associations, but people get tired of the "small town hockey" sham, so they give a reality check. (I don't think even STA ever drew from that many associations! )

You are the one who said a few years ago that Hermantown doesn't allow open enrollment, and I believed you and that was why I defended Hermantown so much against the STA people. But now there are articles in the Duluth newspaper talking about the rampant open enrollment in Hermantown, and that it's been going on for a while. Thus, you were either lying or uninformed when you said they didn't allow open enrollment, and neither makes you look good when you're telling other people to shut up because they "do not really know anything about Hermantown".

Some people on here say things about Plante/Hermantown that is way worse than anything I've ever said, yet you say nothing to them. But, when myself, Froggy, Jeffy95, etc. start telling the truth about how many transfers are at Hermantown and how well they do against top AA teams at youth levels, that's when you get super angry and lash out.

What are you hiding?

Those brothers are not the first to go. There was a few others to Denfeld and 1 or 2 others to Marshall. I'm not into naming kids. You really think they left for AA hockey? Where do you think the would rather be right now?? Most if not all players leave HT Hockey because they may not make Varsity of may not get to play Varsity until they are a Senior. Many kids will play 2 years of JV for their senior year on varsity. Also, Hermantown never takes players from the Bantam team no matter how good they are. Plante just does not do it. The team that lost to sta that last year had 3-5 seniors on it that played very little varsity up until their senior year. Most teams would have taken Watkins as a 9 grader.

As far as open enroll quit changing my words. I never said that they did not allow it, I said most if not all the grades were full so no more can come in. Not sure what the status is on that as of today. Big numbers came when Duluth implemented the red plan and closed Central. Hermantown is much closer than Denfeld for anyone that lives in Duluth Heights or Kenwood plus it's a great school. People did not come just for Hockey and there was no need to recruit.

The recruiting thing is just stupid. Everybody in the area that knows hockey, knows about Hermantown. With all the off season skill camps, the outside ice, etc, Hermantown does not need to recruit. Go to the rink in March/April and you will see kids from all over the arrowhead at one of Pionks several hockey camps. LeBlac also has a camp in the summer that draws kids from all over. Who do you think coaches the U16 and U18 teams? I'll give you a hint - they live in Hermantown. In actuality, Hermantown does more for the local Hockey community than any other organization hands down. Nobody is even close. Even Hibbing kids come down here for camps. Is it any wonder that some stay? Believe me, you don't need to twist their arms. And yes, if you want to play HS Hockey, you need to be good and there is no better place in the Duluth area to get skilled. If you have the desire, there is the opportunity. If you want hockey 12 month of the year, you can get it in Hermantown. That's why I ask you about your summer program. Seriously, until you get one, quit your bitching. And you can also ease up on the bad mouthing of Hermantown. Their program, which is why there good, deserves nothing but respect.

By the way, nobody's perfect - not even you.

[rainier]

You are absolutely wrong about why those brothers went to Marshall. Had absolutely nothing to do with Marshall moving to AA.
Once again, you really do not know anything about Hermantown.

Didn't Flaherty give an interview where he said he discussed going AA with those kids? I think it was the first interview he gave last year when they announced. I could be wrong, but I thought for sure he said so.

You think it was a coincidence that the first time Hermantown has ever lost players to Marshall just happened to be the year Marshall announced their opt up to AA? C'mon, pek.

I'd like to believe you Peky, but every time you tell someone they are full of BS, they go on to give really specific information about something that makes Hermantown look bad, such as Froggy or Jeffy95 pointing out all the open enrollees. I know you don't want the world to find out that the kids on the Hermantown Squirt A team come from seven different associations, but people get tired of the "small town hockey" sham, so they give a reality check. (I don't think even STA ever drew from that many associations! )

You are the one who said a few years ago that Hermantown doesn't allow open enrollment, and I believed you and that was why I defended Hermantown so much against the STA people. But now there are articles in the Duluth newspaper talking about the rampant open enrollment in Hermantown, and that it's been going on for a while. Thus, you were either lying or uninformed when you said they didn't allow open enrollment, and neither makes you look good when you're telling other people to shut up because they "do not really know anything about Hermantown".

Some people on here say things about Plante/Hermantown that is way worse than anything I've ever said, yet you say nothing to them. But, when myself, Froggy, Jeffy95, etc. start telling the truth about how many transfers are at Hermantown and how well they do against top AA teams at youth levels, that's when you get super angry and lash out.

What are you hiding?

Those brothers are not the first to go. There was a few others to Denfeld and 1 or 2 others to Marshall. I'm not into naming kids. You really think they left for AA hockey? Where do you think the would rather be right now?? Most if not all players leave HT Hockey because they may not make Varsity of may not get to play Varsity until they are a Senior. Many kids will play 2 years of JV for their senior year on varsity. Also, Hermantown never takes players from the Bantam team no matter how good they are. Plante just does not do it. The team that lost to sta that last year had 3-5 seniors on it that played very little varsity up until their senior year. Most teams would have taken Watkins as a 9 grader.

As far as open enroll quit changing my words. I never said that they did not allow it, I said most if not all the grades were full so no more can come in. Not sure what the status is on that as of today. Big numbers came when Duluth implemented the red plan and closed Central. Hermantown is much closer than Denfeld for anyone that lives in Duluth Heights or Kenwood plus it's a great school. People did not come just for Hockey and there was no need to recruit.

The recruiting thing is just stupid. Everybody in the area that knows hockey, knows about Hermantown. With all the off season skill camps, the outside ice, etc, Hermantown does not need to recruit. Go to the rink in March/April and you will see kids from all over the arrowhead at one of Pionks several hockey camps. LeBlac also has a camp in the summer that draws kids from all over. Who do you think coaches the U16 and U18 teams? I'll give you a hint - they live in Hermantown. In actuality, Hermantown does more for the local Hockey community than any other organization hands down. Nobody is even close. Even Hibbing kids come down here for camps. Is it any wonder that some stay? Believe me, you don't need to twist their arms. And yes, if you want to play HS Hockey, you need to be good and there is no better place in the Duluth area to get skilled. If you have the desire, there is the opportunity. If you want hockey 12 month of the year, you can get it in Hermantown. That's why I ask you about your summer program. Seriously, until you get one, quit your bitching. And you can also ease up on the bad mouthing of Hermantown. Their program, which is why there good, deserves nothing but respect.

By the way, nobody's perfect - not even you.

There you go again telling us how great the Hermantown program is, but not offering any reasons for why they stay in A. We get it Peky, Hermantown has a great program. No one is saying they're not a great program. In fact, people think so highly of the Hermantown program that they think it's ridiculous that they are in single A.

Saying Hermantown is sandbagging in A is not an indictment on the Hermantown program, it is an indictment on the one person who is holding them back.

You say those kids didn't transfer due to Marshall opting up? Here is the quote from Flaherty in the recent Hub article on Marshall:

The move already swayed families of some freshmen to the Hilltoppers program.

“I know for a fact that the parents saw our schedule and they wanted to play Minnetonka, Benilde-St. Margaret’s and Duluth East,” Flaherty said.

Considering 3 of the 4 Hermantown kids were 9th graders when they went to Marshall, I imagine Flaherty is referring to them. Maybe not.

Also, you claim that kids have left Hermantown for Marshall before, yet here is a quote from Plante from the same article:

Plante said four players, including two sons of a Hermantown youth hockey association coach, left for Duluth Marshall. Plante said he can’t recall losing a player to the Hillltoppers’ program before it moved to Class 2A.

Does Plante also "not really know anything about Hermantown"?

You keep saying I'm full of BS, yet your claims of no open enrollment, Hermantown kids not transferring because of AA, and no kids leaving Hermantown for Marshall can all be easily refuted in published articles in major newspapers.

Tell me again which one of us is full of BS?

[SFA1992]

i think people have a problem with the high school program, not the overall hockey program/environment/town.

if you're running the program with clinics camps pick up etc year round, and all the kids from the area are joining in, you'd think the program/organization responsible for the system would see itself as big time enough to play AA.

if you can play, you can play. why wouldn't a program like that want to be AA? I remember time and again people calling out the "shame" of STA's last couple of titles, and they were right. i'm sure hermantown has a great school system and is a lovely place to live; whether you move there in 1st grade or 9th, you know what you're getting, and the hockey program is a part of that. they've had their shot at a state championship, eventually its time to say enough is enough and move on. that time is long overdue. everyone knows it. personally, i'm relieved i's dragged on this long, it makes what STA did not look as bad. i remember students, players, faculty(not the ones with the power to make the decision, unfortunately), and families all wanting to opt up. not sure what the case is at hermantown. get it over with and move up.

[pekyman]

Didn't Flaherty give an interview where he said he discussed going AA with those kids? I think it was the first interview he gave last year when they announced. I could be wrong, but I thought for sure he said so.

You think it was a coincidence that the first time Hermantown has ever lost players to Marshall just happened to be the year Marshall announced their opt up to AA? C'mon, pek.

I'd like to believe you Peky, but every time you tell someone they are full of BS, they go on to give really specific information about something that makes Hermantown look bad, such as Froggy or Jeffy95 pointing out all the open enrollees. I know you don't want the world to find out that the kids on the Hermantown Squirt A team come from seven different associations, but people get tired of the "small town hockey" sham, so they give a reality check. (I don't think even STA ever drew from that many associations! )

You are the one who said a few years ago that Hermantown doesn't allow open enrollment, and I believed you and that was why I defended Hermantown so much against the STA people. But now there are articles in the Duluth newspaper talking about the rampant open enrollment in Hermantown, and that it's been going on for a while. Thus, you were either lying or uninformed when you said they didn't allow open enrollment, and neither makes you look good when you're telling other people to shut up because they "do not really know anything about Hermantown".

Some people on here say things about Plante/Hermantown that is way worse than anything I've ever said, yet you say nothing to them. But, when myself, Froggy, Jeffy95, etc. start telling the truth about how many transfers are at Hermantown and how well they do against top AA teams at youth levels, that's when you get super angry and lash out.

What are you hiding?

Those brothers are not the first to go. There was a few others to Denfeld and 1 or 2 others to Marshall. I'm not into naming kids. You really think they left for AA hockey? Where do you think the would rather be right now?? Most if not all players leave HT Hockey because they may not make Varsity of may not get to play Varsity until they are a Senior. Many kids will play 2 years of JV for their senior year on varsity. Also, Hermantown never takes players from the Bantam team no matter how good they are. Plante just does not do it. The team that lost to sta that last year had 3-5 seniors on it that played very little varsity up until their senior year. Most teams would have taken Watkins as a 9 grader.

As far as open enroll quit changing my words. I never said that they did not allow it, I said most if not all the grades were full so no more can come in. Not sure what the status is on that as of today. Big numbers came when Duluth implemented the red plan and closed Central. Hermantown is much closer than Denfeld for anyone that lives in Duluth Heights or Kenwood plus it's a great school. People did not come just for Hockey and there was no need to recruit.

The recruiting thing is just stupid. Everybody in the area that knows hockey, knows about Hermantown. With all the off season skill camps, the outside ice, etc, Hermantown does not need to recruit. Go to the rink in March/April and you will see kids from all over the arrowhead at one of Pionks several hockey camps. LeBlac also has a camp in the summer that draws kids from all over. Who do you think coaches the U16 and U18 teams? I'll give you a hint - they live in Hermantown. In actuality, Hermantown does more for the local Hockey community than any other organization hands down. Nobody is even close. Even Hibbing kids come down here for camps. Is it any wonder that some stay? Believe me, you don't need to twist their arms. And yes, if you want to play HS Hockey, you need to be good and there is no better place in the Duluth area to get skilled. If you have the desire, there is the opportunity. If you want hockey 12 month of the year, you can get it in Hermantown. That's why I ask you about your summer program. Seriously, until you get one, quit your bitching. And you can also ease up on the bad mouthing of Hermantown. Their program, which is why there good, deserves nothing but respect.

By the way, nobody's perfect - not even you.

There you go again telling us how great the Hermantown program is, but not offering any reasons for why they stay in A. We get it Peky, Hermantown has a great program. No one is saying they're not a great program. In fact, people think so highly of the Hermantown program that they think it's ridiculous that they are in single A.

Saying Hermantown is sandbagging in A is not an indictment on the Hermantown program, it is an indictment on the one person who is holding them back.

You say those kids didn't transfer due to Marshall opting up? Here is the quote from Flaherty in the recent Hub article on Marshall:

The move already swayed families of some freshmen to the Hilltoppers program.

“I know for a fact that the parents saw our schedule and they wanted to play Minnetonka, Benilde-St. Margaret’s and Duluth East,” Flaherty said.

Considering 3 of the 4 Hermantown kids were 9th graders when they went to Marshall, I imagine Flaherty is referring to them. Maybe not.

Also, you claim that kids have left Hermantown for Marshall before, yet here is a quote from Plante from the same article:

Plante said four players, including two sons of a Hermantown youth hockey association coach, left for Duluth Marshall. Plante said he can’t recall losing a player to the Hillltoppers’ program before it moved to Class 2A.

Does Plante also "not really know anything about Hermantown"?

You keep saying I'm full of BS, yet your claims of no open enrollment, Hermantown kids not transferring because of AA, and no kids leaving Hermantown for Marshall can all be easily refuted in published articles in major newspapers.

Tell me again which one of us is full of BS?

Do you believe everything you read in the papers? What do you think they would say. Did you hear me say Plante does not take 9th graders? Did you hear me say may not play until senior year??
Don't think any of those kids even made the Bantam AA team and they are both starting and playing at Marshall. That's not a good way to get better that Hermantown is it.

Also, I never said they should never move up, I sent you a long PM on it a while back. Why don't you re-read it.

They made a decision that works for them and I have no issue with it.

[pekyman]

Those brothers are not the first to go. There was a few others to Denfeld and 1 or 2 others to Marshall. I'm not into naming kids. You really think they left for AA hockey? Where do you think the would rather be right now?? Most if not all players leave HT Hockey because they may not make Varsity of may not get to play Varsity until they are a Senior. Many kids will play 2 years of JV for their senior year on varsity. Also, Hermantown never takes players from the Bantam team no matter how good they are. Plante just does not do it. The team that lost to sta that last year had 3-5 seniors on it that played very little varsity up until their senior year. Most teams would have taken Watkins as a 9 grader.

As far as open enroll quit changing my words. I never said that they did not allow it, I said most if not all the grades were full so no more can come in. Not sure what the status is on that as of today. Big numbers came when Duluth implemented the red plan and closed Central. Hermantown is much closer than Denfeld for anyone that lives in Duluth Heights or Kenwood plus it's a great school. People did not come just for Hockey and there was no need to recruit.

The recruiting thing is just stupid. Everybody in the area that knows hockey, knows about Hermantown. With all the off season skill camps, the outside ice, etc, Hermantown does not need to recruit. Go to the rink in March/April and you will see kids from all over the arrowhead at one of Pionks several hockey camps. LeBlac also has a camp in the summer that draws kids from all over. Who do you think coaches the U16 and U18 teams? I'll give you a hint - they live in Hermantown. In actuality, Hermantown does more for the local Hockey community than any other organization hands down. Nobody is even close. Even Hibbing kids come down here for camps. Is it any wonder that some stay? Believe me, you don't need to twist their arms. And yes, if you want to play HS Hockey, you need to be good and there is no better place in the Duluth area to get skilled. If you have the desire, there is the opportunity. If you want hockey 12 month of the year, you can get it in Hermantown. That's why I ask you about your summer program. Seriously, until you get one, quit your bitching. And you can also ease up on the bad mouthing of Hermantown. Their program, which is why there good, deserves nothing but respect.

By the way, nobody's perfect - not even you.

There you go again telling us how great the Hermantown program is, but not offering any reasons for why they stay in A. We get it Peky, Hermantown has a great program. No one is saying they're not a great program. In fact, people think so highly of the Hermantown program that they think it's ridiculous that they are in single A.

Saying Hermantown is sandbagging in A is not an indictment on the Hermantown program, it is an indictment on the one person who is holding them back.

You say those kids didn't transfer due to Marshall opting up? Here is the quote from Flaherty in the recent Hub article on Marshall:

The move already swayed families of some freshmen to the Hilltoppers program.

“I know for a fact that the parents saw our schedule and they wanted to play Minnetonka, Benilde-St. Margaret’s and Duluth East,” Flaherty said.

Considering 3 of the 4 Hermantown kids were 9th graders when they went to Marshall, I imagine Flaherty is referring to them. Maybe not.

Also, you claim that kids have left Hermantown for Marshall before, yet here is a quote from Plante from the same article:

Plante said four players, including two sons of a Hermantown youth hockey association coach, left for Duluth Marshall. Plante said he can’t recall losing a player to the Hillltoppers’ program before it moved to Class 2A.

Does Plante also "not really know anything about Hermantown"?

You keep saying I'm full of BS, yet your claims of no open enrollment, Hermantown kids not transferring because of AA, and no kids leaving Hermantown for Marshall can all be easily refuted in published articles in major newspapers.

Tell me again which one of us is full of BS?

Do you believe everything you read in the papers? What do you think they would say. Did you hear me say Plante does not take 9th graders? Did you hear me say may not play until senior year??
Don't think any of those kids even made the Bantam AA team and they are both starting and playing at Marshall. That's not a good way to get better that Hermantown is it.

Also, I never said they should never move up, I sent you a long PM on it a while back. Why don't you re-read it.

They made a decision that works for them and I have no issue with it.

Hermantown's schedule is stronger than Marshalls this year.
And the other Hermantown kid that went to Marshall would have not made the Varsity team. Plante did not even know him.

[rainier]

I'd believe actual quotes from Plante and Flaherty before I'd believe you.

You said kids have left Hermantown for Marshall before, Plante says differently.

You said open enrollment was closed at Hermantown, Hermantown school officials say differently.

You say those kids didn't leave Hermantown because of Marshall being in AA, Flaherty says differently.

Please stop accusing me of spreading BS when all I'm doing is quoting what the coaches and school officials have publicly said.

And Hermantown has a tougher schedule than Marshall? Why would an A team have a tougher schedule than a AA team? Why does Hermantown have such a tough schedule but then play A for the playoffs? What's the ultimate goal for Hermantown, to play the top 25 AA teams during the regular season but then still play A for playoffs?

You want a really tough schedule, Hermantown? Then play AA and you will get the best competition all the way through playoffs too, and not just during the regular season.

[pekyman]

I'd believe actual quotes from Plante and Flaherty before I'd believe you.

You said kids have left Hermantown for Marshall before, Plante says differently.

You said open enrollment was closed at Hermantown, Hermantown school officials say differently.

You say those kids didn't leave Hermantown because of Marshall being in AA, Flaherty says differently.

Please stop accusing me of spreading BS when all I'm doing is quoting what the coaches and school officials have publicly said.

And Hermantown has a tougher schedule than Marshall? Why would an A team have a tougher schedule than a AA team? Why does Hermantown have such a tough schedule but then play A for the playoffs? What's the ultimate goal for Hermantown, to play the top 25 AA teams during the regular season but then still play A for playoffs?

You want a really tough schedule, Hermantown? Then play AA and you will get the best competition all the way through playoffs too, and not just during the regular season.

You can believe what you want. There are 2 that went to Marshall a few years ago. Plante wouldn't know them because they were not that good had other issues. Plante isn't lying and neither am I. If you really want names I could PM you but you don't want to hear the truth anyway.

What I said about open enrollment was that the school can only so many kids in each class and at the time we were talking about this, all the classes were full at about 618 total students.

As far as Flaherty saying they came for AA, he is relying on that to get him kids because he does not have a youth association that develops them for his team, he needs to take from other's. Of course he is going to market that. Fact is he pulled some of the best kids to his team from east and denfeld when Marshall was A and they went back to their home teams when, on your worst day, Hermantown was placed back in 5A. At Hermantown, one of those brothers would still be a bantam and the other would be JV for at least 1 and probably 2 years. Marshall looked good as they both would be playing varsity hockey this year. If he could have gotten that at Hermantown, they would both still be here. There is also a rumor that there was a financial reward to them to go there but I have no idea if it is true. Now that is real recruiting.

[karl(east)]