Playing Both Elite League and USHL

flatontheice · Post by **flatontheice** » Fri Sep 23, 2011 1:22 pm

Should this be alowed or is this opening a big can of worms?

Gopher Blog · Post by **Gopher Blog** » Fri Sep 23, 2011 1:50 pm

flatontheice wrote:Should this be alowed or is this opening a big can of worms?

Seems like it should be one or the other but not both.

observer · Post by **observer** » Fri Sep 23, 2011 1:54 pm

No it shouldn't be allowed. Why do you ask?

One of the reasons the Elite League was started was to suggest players could get similar development without leaving MN HS hockey with the addition of Elite League games to the 25 regular season high school games. It would make no sense to allow players to do both. Not sure it would even be possible based on where some of the USHL teams are based and they also play a heavy weekend schedule.

gopherpuck516 · Post by **gopherpuck516** » Fri Sep 23, 2011 2:14 pm

It's possible to play both if a player plays Elite League in the fall and USHL in the spring after their HS season is over, but probably not both concurrently.

keepyourheadup · Post by **keepyourheadup** » Fri Sep 23, 2011 2:34 pm

It takes just the right set of circumstances for a player to do both (elite in the fall..ushl in the spring). Last year I think four or five kids did it. Both Brodzinski and Kloos had not yet been drafted so it allowed their respective teams to play them in ten games and acquire their rights outside the draft. I think Sioux falls kept Rau on the active roster all year so he could play in the spring. Drafted players not on the active roster usually go on a USHL affiliate list and are eligible to play in ...I believe..six games. This gives drafted players still in high school a very small window of opportunity. It helps explain why Camarnisi didn't play last year and Kloos did for Waterloo.

Gopher Blog · Post by **Gopher Blog** » Fri Sep 23, 2011 3:04 pm

I don't have an issue if it is fall elite league and spring USHL. I thought he was asking both concurrently if it was logistically possible.

keepyourheadup · Post by **keepyourheadup** » Fri Sep 23, 2011 3:45 pm

Understood, Elite league rules state that they will not allow a player to do both at the same time. Last year Sit tried and after playing in Chicago was not allowed back in the league or the NIT.

flatontheice · Post by **flatontheice** » Fri Sep 23, 2011 9:08 pm

keepyourheadup wrote:Understood, Elite league rules state that they will not allow a player to do both at the same time. Last year Sit tried and after playing in Chicago was not allowed back in the league or the NIT.

Two kids did it this week. Thats why I raised the question. They both played in Elite League last weekend and in two USHL games in the Fall Classic this week. I believe it was Brodzinski and Janco. It will be interesting to see if the league stays consistent with the policy as certainly one of these is a very high profile player.

keepyourheadup · Post by **keepyourheadup** » Sat Sep 24, 2011 12:27 am

Wow, didn't know that......you are right....it will be real interesting to see what the elite league does on this one.

observer · Post by **observer** » Sat Sep 24, 2011 7:42 am

That's Weird. What's the point of that?

Have they already been drafted by those teams? Did they attend the tryouts of those teams? Might they play USHL this winter season instead of MSHSL? Keeping options open?

The USHL rosters are already fat. I guess this tourney is different as some rosters still have as many as 31 skaters when I thought they were to be at 23 by now. I wouldn't like to be a player on those teams and see yet a few more show up for some goofy reason.

mulefarm · Post by **mulefarm** » Sun Sep 25, 2011 7:35 pm

Why would anybody or league want to hold back the top kids. Maybe this attitude is what is hurting Mn hockey? Let them play as much as they want until their HS season starts. A real non issue.

flatontheice · Post by **flatontheice** » Tue Sep 27, 2011 4:09 pm

mulefarm wrote:Why would anybody or league want to hold back the top kids. Maybe this attitude is what is hurting Mn hockey? Let them play as much as they want until their HS season starts. A real non issue.

Minnesota Hockey isnt hurting.

outside_observer · Post by **outside_observer** » Thu Sep 29, 2011 3:31 pm

flatontheice wrote:Should this be alowed or is this opening a big can of worms?

Apparently the Min Made - District 6 Lawsuit is already out of your consciousness. The Elite League has absolutely no right to tell anyone that they cannot play in whatever other league they want to. Now the one rule that they can enforce, about attendance, they don't.

This league's original intentions are great, but it is run by a bunch of Alexander's, so it really begins to look like it is all about the money. Nothing to do with bettering hockey.

The players that have the opportunity to leave and go to the USHL, NAHL canadian juniors, etc.... are going to. This league is not keeping anyone around.

Fatontheice, what was your purpose for this post?
I wonder why you put the kids names in here?

auld_skool · Post by **auld_skool** » Thu Sep 29, 2011 3:56 pm

mulefarm wrote: A real non issue.

Agreed. flatontheice must be bored or has another agenda.

keepyourheadup · Post by **keepyourheadup** » Thu Sep 29, 2011 4:17 pm

Not sure where the shots at the Elite league came from. One might think that outside_observer has an agenda as well. While I can't speak for every kid in the league I'm absolutely certain of at least one player who could have left for the USHL and stayed. If not for the Elite league he'd be gone.
I do agree that its not a big deal and the league is overly sensitve about the issue but to broadly state that the league isn't keeping ANYONE around is false. Like all things, the Elite league leaves room for improvement but for most its the best alternative available.[/quote]

outside_observer · Post by **outside_observer** » Fri Sep 30, 2011 11:57 am

keepyourheadup wrote:Not sure where the shots at the Elite league came from. One might think that outside_observer has an agenda as well. While I can't speak for every kid in the league I'm absolutely certain of at least one player who could have left for the USHL and stayed. If not for the Elite league he'd be gone.
I do agree that its not a big deal and the league is overly sensitve about the issue but to broadly state that the league isn't keeping ANYONE around is false. Like all things, the Elite league leaves room for improvement but for most its the best alternative available.

Well, everyone has an agenda.
Mine is "Truth, Justice and the American way"
"Baseball, hot dogs, Apple Pie and Chevrolet"

The athlete that you know, did not want to go to the USHL, or he would have. Simple as that.

And before you say anything, no, neither I nor any of my family have ever been 'shafted' by the Elite League.

keepyourheadup · Post by **keepyourheadup** » Fri Sep 30, 2011 12:17 pm

There goes the same line of bs we've been debating for years, its a unique choice for each individual player to leave or not. The fact is he made the team and chose not to go. His own choice, not his coach, not his parents but his. The option of being able to play hockey in the fall at home was a big factor. No Elite league and he likely goes, giving up all the things a high school kid gets to experience graduating with his friends. The fact that the league exists does persuade some kids to stay.

outside_observer · Post by **outside_observer** » Fri Sep 30, 2011 12:56 pm

It's human nature, if you really want to do something you do it.
If you don't or are on the fence you look for reasons not to.

You agreed with me.
He wants to stay with his friends and family.

keepyourheadup · Post by **keepyourheadup** » Fri Sep 30, 2011 12:59 pm

fair enough

flatontheice · Post by **flatontheice** » Fri Sep 30, 2011 2:37 pm

outside_observer wrote:
flatontheice wrote:Should this be alowed or is this opening a big can of worms?
Apparently the Min Made - District 6 Lawsuit is already out of your consciousness. The Elite League has absolutely no right to tell anyone that they cannot play in whatever other league they want to. Now the one rule that they can enforce, about attendance, they don't.

This league's original intentions are great, but it is run by a bunch of Alexander's, so it really begins to look like it is all about the money. Nothing to do with bettering hockey.

The players that have the opportunity to leave and go to the USHL, NAHL canadian juniors, etc.... are going to. This league is not keeping anyone around.

Fatontheice, what was your purpose for this post?
I wonder why you put the kids names in here?

No agenda. Didn't realize who it was a secret since their names were on the scoresheets from USHL Fall Classic. I just put it out there for debate.

The Exiled One · Post by **The Exiled One** » Fri Sep 30, 2011 8:35 pm

flatontheice wrote:
outside_observer wrote:
flatontheice wrote:Should this be alowed or is this opening a big can of worms?
Apparently the Min Made - District 6 Lawsuit is already out of your consciousness. The Elite League has absolutely no right to tell anyone that they cannot play in whatever other league they want to. Now the one rule that they can enforce, about attendance, they don't.

This league's original intentions are great, but it is run by a bunch of Alexander's, so it really begins to look like it is all about the money. Nothing to do with bettering hockey.

The players that have the opportunity to leave and go to the USHL, NAHL canadian juniors, etc.... are going to. This league is not keeping anyone around.

Fatontheice, what was your purpose for this post?
I wonder why you put the kids names in here?
No agenda. Didn't realize who it was a secret since their names were on the scoresheets from USHL Fall Classic. I just put it out there for debate.

I didn't see Michael Brodzinski on any USHL scoresheets. Do you have a link?

Neuuman · Post by **Neuuman** » Fri Sep 30, 2011 9:25 pm

outside_observer wrote:
keepyourheadup wrote:Not sure where the shots at the Elite league came from. One might think that outside_observer has an agenda as well. While I can't speak for every kid in the league I'm absolutely certain of at least one player who could have left for the USHL and stayed. If not for the Elite league he'd be gone.
I do agree that its not a big deal and the league is overly sensitve about the issue but to broadly state that the league isn't keeping ANYONE around is false. Like all things, the Elite league leaves room for improvement but for most its the best alternative available.
Well, everyone has an agenda.
Mine is "Truth, Justice and the American way"
"Baseball, hot dogs, Apple Pie and Chevrolet"

The athlete that you know, did not want to go to the USHL, or he would have. Simple as that.

And before you say anything, no, neither I nor any of my family have ever been 'shafted' by the Elite League.

The players that have the opportunity to leave and go to the USHL, NAHL canadian juniors, etc.... are going to

Per your words above, NOT every player that has the opportunity to leave does. Do you really think, in the past few years, Nick Leddy, Kyle Rau, and Bjugstad DIDN"T have the opportunity to leave? Do you really believe Kyle Rau played elite league and high school hockey last year because he had no options at the next level? Your statement above definitely applies to some players, but to make a "blanket statement" like that is ludicrous.

IMHO

flatontheice · Post by **flatontheice** » Mon Oct 03, 2011 7:47 am

The Exiled One wrote:
flatontheice wrote:
outside_observer wrote: Apparently the Min Made - District 6 Lawsuit is already out of your consciousness. The Elite League has absolutely no right to tell anyone that they cannot play in whatever other league they want to. Now the one rule that they can enforce, about attendance, they don't.

This league's original intentions are great, but it is run by a bunch of Alexander's, so it really begins to look like it is all about the money. Nothing to do with bettering hockey.

The players that have the opportunity to leave and go to the USHL, NAHL canadian juniors, etc.... are going to. This league is not keeping anyone around.

Fatontheice, what was your purpose for this post?
I wonder why you put the kids names in here?
No agenda. Didn't realize who it was a secret since their names were on the scoresheets from USHL Fall Classic. I just put it out there for debate.
I didn't see Michael Brodzinski on any USHL scoresheets. Do you have a link?

He was on the scoresheet and then they changed it.

keepyourheadup · Post by **keepyourheadup** » Mon Oct 03, 2011 8:23 am

Just the fact that they changed the scoresheet leads one to beleive they knew it was a risky plan.

The Exiled One · Post by **The Exiled One** » Mon Oct 03, 2011 8:52 am

flatontheice wrote:
The Exiled One wrote:
flatontheice wrote: He was on the scoresheet and then they changed it.
For which team? You sure they didn't accidently type Michael when they meant Jonny? Also, somebody may have accidently typed in names from the protected list. I just don't see a benefit to Michael to play preseason in the USHL, so it's difficult for me to imagine him doing that.

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