Things that make you wonder.....

Discussion of Minnesota Youth Hockey

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HockeyDad41
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Joined: Mon Feb 23, 2009 6:40 pm

Post by HockeyDad41 »

MrBoDangles wrote:I guess it will be another out of the blue change that many won't like......We must have been100% wrong all these years.

Would of probably been smart to try it out for 40% of the contests or do it more in practice hours. Nope, should not have full games at all anymore in Mites.



Bernie scores again. :idea:
IMO the mite level is not real hockey yet, it's preparation for real hockey. At least that's the way I view it and for all practical purposes so does the district I reside in. They don't keep any standings for any of the mite teams, they don't put any scores up on the board during the games, they don't put any kids in the penalty box for committing a penalty. They are not allowed to play in any tournaments (except for a year end jamboree).

With the exception of the advanced mite teams, I don't really have a problem with half ice matches. What's the rush to have a 6 year old skating full ice?


Also, I find it interesting that in a completely unrelated topic you have once again found a way to bring up BM. But since you brought it up.... If the implication is that BM will benefit as more and more people will opt for the choice league for mites because of the full ice thing, you might be right. I kind of doubt he can add any more teams in the winter though as his ice is booked solid already with what he currently has and I haven't heard anything lately about adding another sheet. I suppose there is always a way.
Solving all of hockey's problems since Feb 2009.
PanthersIn2011
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Re: Things that make you wonder.....

Post by PanthersIn2011 »

MrBoDangles wrote:The reason I bring it up is because we always hear parents say they can't wait until their kids play on full ice. Are you able to honestly say that you were not interested at all in your kids first full ice games?
I can't speak for parents in general -- only for myself. I much prefer watching young players in a small ice game learning how to make plays. I cringe every time I see "mite blob", consuming only about 1/8 of a sheet of ice. The small area games look a lot more like hockey to me.

Full ice 5 v 5 with stoppages to change lines and set up a face off (wasted 30 seconds every two minutes).

Or 3 games of 3 v 3 small area games running continuously. Heck, you can probably go 4 v 4 if you want.

10 kids versus 18-24 kids involved at any given time.

Seems like a no brainer to me.
hockeyfan74
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Post by hockeyfan74 »

[Full ice 5 v 5 with stoppages to change lines and set up a face off (wasted 30 seconds every two minutes).]

Panthersin2011 - As I have stated before. There needs to be a combination. In my opinion the Top Level mites should mainly play full-ice. If they are playing full-ice they should also change on the fly. My mite teams have never had a challenge with changing on the fly - keeps the flow going as well. Blowing the horn every 2 minutes for a shift change is a pile of it. Why would you want to teach young players to stay out for 2 minutes anyway?
InigoMontoya
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Post by InigoMontoya »

[quoteThis is BS, you watch a badly run practice and tear down ADM, you watch a full ice (most likely advanced last year mite) game and come to the conclusion full ice is the way to go. If you saw a bad practice blame the adults on the ice and not adm.[/quote]

I didn't even mention the ADM.
MnMade-4-Life
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Post by MnMade-4-Life »

royals dad wrote:[...] Never once in the last 20 years of coaching has it crossed my mind that I was there to entertain parents.
agreed, that's why WiFi was installed in most rinks!!
/chugga chugga
/chugga chugga
WOOOOOOOOO
WOOOOOOOOO
PanthersIn2011
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Post by PanthersIn2011 »

hockeyfan74 wrote:[Full ice 5 v 5 with stoppages to change lines and set up a face off (wasted 30 seconds every two minutes).]

Panthersin2011 - As I have stated before. There needs to be a combination. In my opinion the Top Level mites should mainly play full-ice. If they are playing full-ice they should also change on the fly. My mite teams have never had a challenge with changing on the fly - keeps the flow going as well. Blowing the horn every 2 minutes for a shift change is a pile of it. Why would you want to teach young players to stay out for 2 minutes anyway?
I wouldn't :)

But at that age, changing on the fly is pretty far down on the priority list. Fundamentals of skating, puck handling, passing and shooting are the key.

My association does a nice job of actively pulling more advanced mites up into in-house squirt C and B2 leagues where they get 1 full ice game a week. These are kids who have demonstrated fundamentals well enough to where full ice makes sense (being able to give and receive a 20 foot pass, etc.). But we are fortunate to have numbers and I realize that this is not the case everywhere. Maybe we're saying the same thing.

When my oldest came through, our super mites were on the ice 2 hours per week and one of those was a full ice game. I would much rather see an approach that better utilizes ice hours and gets those kids another 1/2 hour a week at the same cost.

FWIW: As a cost savings, I think it makes perfect sense to have upper level (PW and Bantam) teams share an hour on a regular basis. Warm up as a group and then play small area games for 50 minutes on half a sheet. There is a lot to be learned by playing SAGs.
hockeyfan74
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Post by hockeyfan74 »

[But at that age, changing on the fly is pretty far down on the priority list. Fundamentals of skating, puck handling, passing and shooting are the key.]

I agree it is all about skill development, but it really doesn't take much for players to learn how to change on the fly. I never have and never would waste practice time working on change on the fly, breakouts or any other systems at mite hockey. The kids I have worked with pick it up on their own. In our association they don't allow mites to move up to squirts which limits our top level mites. When I ran the mites I only had two days of indoor ice, but we also went outside two days a week. One of those was strictly pond hockey with no instruction just let the kids go out and have fun. Then we would have two practices (typically one indoor and one outdoor) that we could do a ton of skill work and small area games - including some cross-ice games. I would also try to get one full ice game per week. I really believe there are a lot of benefits to both cross-ice and full-ice games. Once again it doesn't have to be all or nothing.[/quote]
silentbutdeadly3139
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Post by silentbutdeadly3139 »

PanthersIn2011 wrote:
hockeyfan74 wrote:[Full ice 5 v 5 with stoppages to change lines and set up a face off (wasted 30 seconds every two minutes).]

Panthersin2011 - As I have stated before. There needs to be a combination. In my opinion the Top Level mites should mainly play full-ice. If they are playing full-ice they should also change on the fly. My mite teams have never had a challenge with changing on the fly - keeps the flow going as well. Blowing the horn every 2 minutes for a shift change is a pile of it. Why would you want to teach young players to stay out for 2 minutes anyway?
I wouldn't :)

But at that age, changing on the fly is pretty far down on the priority list. Fundamentals of skating, puck handling, passing and shooting are the key.

My association does a nice job of actively pulling more advanced mites up into in-house squirt C and B2 leagues where they get 1 full ice game a week. These are kids who have demonstrated fundamentals well enough to where full ice makes sense (being able to give and receive a 20 foot pass, etc.). But we are fortunate to have numbers and I realize that this is not the case everywhere. Maybe we're saying the same thing.

When my oldest came through, our super mites were on the ice 2 hours per week and one of those was a full ice game. I would much rather see an approach that better utilizes ice hours and gets those kids another 1/2 hour a week at the same cost.

FWIW: As a cost savings, I think it makes perfect sense to have upper level (PW and Bantam) teams share an hour on a regular basis. Warm up as a group and then play small area games for 50 minutes on half a sheet. There is a lot to be learned by playing SAGs.
Thats the problem, the ADM and many people here are working in absolutes saying mites do not need, benefit or capable of playing full ice games. As you and many others find that there are mites that can and do benefit from full ice games and that is what many of us are saying : there should be a mix of full and cross ice games or some mechanism for those mites who demonstrate the abilities to play full ice games.
O-townClown
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Post by O-townClown »

silentbutdeadly3139 wrote:Thats the problem, the ADM and many people here are working in absolutes saying mites do not need, benefit or capable of playing full ice games. As you and many others find that there are mites that can and do benefit from full ice games and that is what many of us are saying : there should be a mix of full and cross ice games or some mechanism for those mites who demonstrate the abilities to play full ice games.
My experience has been that USA Hockey is very supportive of programs that are finding a way to embrace the RW&B concepts. I'm sorry yours has only been that rigid adherence to 100% (and only 100%) is acceptable.

Is your ADM rep so strict he won't support a gradual transition to incorporate these ideas?
Be kind. Rewind.
silentbutdeadly3139
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Post by silentbutdeadly3139 »

O-townClown wrote:
silentbutdeadly3139 wrote:Thats the problem, the ADM and many people here are working in absolutes saying mites do not need, benefit or capable of playing full ice games. As you and many others find that there are mites that can and do benefit from full ice games and that is what many of us are saying : there should be a mix of full and cross ice games or some mechanism for those mites who demonstrate the abilities to play full ice games.
My experience has been that USA Hockey is very supportive of programs that are finding a way to embrace the RW&B concepts. I'm sorry yours has only been that rigid adherence to 100% (and only 100%) is acceptable.

Is your ADM rep so strict he won't support a gradual transition to incorporate these ideas?
What is an ADM rep :? I admit I'm not an expert or long seasoned veteran but thats appears to be the problem : some are rules others are recommendations and people are confusing them. You can see it with the comments on this and other threads, people are saying, thinking or hoping things like RW&B are rules and going by the letter of the rule.
MrBoDangles
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Post by MrBoDangles »

O-townClown wrote:
silentbutdeadly3139 wrote:Thats the problem, the ADM and many people here are working in absolutes saying mites do not need, benefit or capable of playing full ice games. As you and many others find that there are mites that can and do benefit from full ice games and that is what many of us are saying : there should be a mix of full and cross ice games or some mechanism for those mites who demonstrate the abilities to play full ice games.
My experience has been that USA Hockey is very supportive of programs that are finding a way to embrace the RW&B concepts. I'm sorry yours has only been that rigid adherence to 100% (and only 100%) is acceptable.

Is your ADM rep so strict he won't support a gradual transition to incorporate these ideas?
What do you think the percentages should be then for the I, D, C, B, and A levels? I don't think there is a need for full ice at the I and A levels. Give us your opinion...

What should a parent do that doesn't agree with five years of Hockey before their first game? Should a parent stay at the mercy of what their association chooses?
O-townClown
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Post by O-townClown »

silentbutdeadly3139 wrote:What is an ADM rep :? I admit I'm not an expert or long seasoned veteran but thats appears to be the problem : some are rules others are recommendations and people are confusing them. You can see it with the comments on this and other threads, people are saying, thinking or hoping things like RW&B are rules and going by the letter of the rule.
http://www.admkids.com/regionalManagers.php

Your ADM rep is Guy Gosselin. These folks are charged with spreading the word. Ours is often in our state, showing kids, parents, coaches, and hockey directors the benefits of incorporating RW&B hockey into their curriculum.

1/2 of Colorado, most of New York, parts of Massachusetts, and possibly some other areas have adopted an "all in" approach. We have not. I posted the phase-in Pittsburgh plan in another thread. My impression is that Minnesota has been slow to change, and I don't mean that in a bad way at all.

Using a mega-association like Edina as an example, their Termite program was basically clinic style and the first two years of Mites relied heavily on crossice or half-ice games. Do they really need to change alot when they are most of the way there?

A topic of discussion at the USA Hockey Winter Meeting two weeks ago was parents taking players outside of an affiliate as a way to get around the hardline ADM mandate chosen by some areas. (I call this "Mite flight") Minnesota doesn't have flight issues because of the residency requirement. I suppose a St. Paul area kid could enroll in Hudson, but doesn't Wisconsin have residency requirements for many of their levels? (I know their Tier I runs differently.)

If Guy Gosselin is anything like Scott Paluch, our ADM rep, I think you'll find him supportive of any and all ideas that are incorporating these principles. Swing the pendulum in the other direction and you won't be able to count on his support.

For those that haven't seen it, the newest RW&B hockey brochure is beyond outstanding. I can't seem to find a copy online. Also, the brochure covering all the ADM is quite good too. http://www.admkids.com/pdf/ADMGuide_2011.pdf

It is recommended that people watch the Dr. Norris video. http://www.admkids.com/media.php

Only when people (parents, coaches, hockey directors) get a shared understanding of what USA Hockey is trying to do can we begin to have an intelligent discussion. When exchanges often go like this...

Guy A: I don't like it.
Guy #2: What don't you like about it?
A: I dunno. I just don't like it. Why change?

...you can see there is a lot of work to be done.

Sometimes Guy A says, "I watched a Mite game the other day and the kids had no trouble with *fillintheblank*." This is true. I see those games all the time. First, there is nothing wrong with the oldest and most experienced playing some big-boy hockey in my book. My guess is it won't die. Even for the strict adherents like Colorado, who's to say there won't be a Spring option that lets the kids play a half-dozen games? Second, while there may be nothing wrong with it, what if the goal is to have a wave of Americans that are better than Parise, Pavelski, Kane, and whoever else? My suspicion is that we have to train the brain to make faster decisions from a very young age. I don't see how full ice games for 6 and 7-year-olds do that.

I don't see Minnesota having a mandate. Interesting that the affiliate presidents voted overwhelmingly to have a nationwide mandate from USA Hockey. (It was just a straw poll to gauge interest, nothing more.) Affiliates don't like getting caught in the middle. They'd rather have more concrete direction from above.
Be kind. Rewind.
O-townClown
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Post by O-townClown »

MrBoDangles wrote:What do you think the percentages should be then for the I, D, C, B, and A levels? I don't think there is a need for full ice at the I and A levels. Give us your opinion...

What should a parent do that doesn't agree with five years of Hockey before their first game? Should a parent stay at the mercy of what their association chooses?
I am not familiar with I/D/C/B/A levels. My opinion is that in Minnesota, where Mites are older and most likely started at a younger age than their peers, it makes sense for 3rd graders to play mostly full-ice games. Maybe a 75/25 split. 2nd graders more like crossice for most of the season and a little transition at the end to make it 75/25. 1st graders 100/0 favoring small-area. Of course, in smaller associations it may make sense for the most advanced 3rd grader to play up at Squirt. (Bowling Green has a rule that they have to test out to be at average level or above to play Squirts. No kids can play up if they will be in the bottom of that group. I think it is a good policy for some areas.)

I feel for the kids of any association that has them playing five years before a game. Ours has an intro group that even gets to scrimmage. Standard Mini-Mite hours, once weekly, in ours is 30 minutes of skating drills followed by 30 minutes of crossice game time, in their first year of hockey. I find it appalling that any program has kids doing skill development for five years before having them understand this is a competitive game.

Reminds me of an older golf pro that had an attractive young female student. He had her convinced she needed to practice for something like two years before entering events. I think it was because he was dating her and figured she'd bail if his expert instruction wasn't resulting in professional success.

USA Hockey has excellent materials that advocate competition as a big part of RW&B. People that want to see change in an association like that should share these with those setting curriculum.

But seriously, five years with no game play? That's excessive. My son has only owned skates for 47 months.
Be kind. Rewind.
muckandgrind
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Post by muckandgrind »

silentbutdeadly3139 wrote:
O-townClown wrote:
silentbutdeadly3139 wrote:Thats the problem, the ADM and many people here are working in absolutes saying mites do not need, benefit or capable of playing full ice games. As you and many others find that there are mites that can and do benefit from full ice games and that is what many of us are saying : there should be a mix of full and cross ice games or some mechanism for those mites who demonstrate the abilities to play full ice games.
My experience has been that USA Hockey is very supportive of programs that are finding a way to embrace the RW&B concepts. I'm sorry yours has only been that rigid adherence to 100% (and only 100%) is acceptable.

Is your ADM rep so strict he won't support a gradual transition to incorporate these ideas?
What is an ADM rep :? I admit I'm not an expert or long seasoned veteran but thats appears to be the problem : some are rules others are recommendations and people are confusing them. You can see it with the comments on this and other threads, people are saying, thinking or hoping things like RW&B are rules and going by the letter of the rule.
If you've studied any Soviet military history at all, you would surely have learned about the Political Commissars....I'm thinking the ADM Reps will be the modern-day equivalent of them. :D
The Huge Hook
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Post by The Huge Hook »

O-townClown wrote:.
Using a mega-association like Edina as an example, their Termite program was basically clinic style and the first two years of Mites relied heavily on crossice or half-ice games. Do they really need to change alot when they are most of the way there?

A topic of discussion at the USA Hockey Winter Meeting two weeks ago was parents taking players outside of an affiliate as a way to get around the hardline ADM mandate chosen by some areas. (I call this "Mite flight") Minnesota doesn't have flight issues because of the residency requirement.
In Edina, I can think of an old tennis complex where a great deal of "Mite flight" is taking place. I know many who are fleeing ADM and it isn't quite a mandate yet. :lol: :lol:

I know I fled =D> =D> =D>
O-townClown
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Post by O-townClown »

Huge, there are some things Bernie does that incorporate the spirit of LTAD principles. I'm not close to it like you are, but he seems to agree with the importance of training at a young age.

I've said it many times. My son would probably be in the Choice program. If you live close - like you - and want to get more ice time than the association offers, it does make sense.

And in no way does that mean the SW suburban associations are not doing an excellent job too.
Be kind. Rewind.
The Huge Hook
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Post by The Huge Hook »

O-townClown wrote:Huge, there are some things Bernie does that incorporate the spirit of LTAD principles. I'm not close to it like you are, but he seems to agree with the importance of training at a young age.

I've said it many times. My son would probably be in the Choice program. If you live close - like you - and want to get more ice time than the association offers, it does make sense.

And in no way does that mean the SW suburban associations are not doing an excellent job too.
With full ice games?????????........the horror! Off to the rink right now....see ya :D
MN_Hcky_Coach
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Post by MN_Hcky_Coach »

Question...How many hours of skill development does MM give the kids in between full ice games?

I ask this because most associations only have 2 hours per week for mites and there is no argument that can support spending any of that time on full ice games when the kids could be spending those 2 hours a week on skills.

Not to mention, they play enough games when they get to squirts, peewees and bantams.

My guess, MM has 3 or 4 hours of skill development and SAGs for every 1 full ice game per week.

????
The Huge Hook
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Post by The Huge Hook »

MN_Hcky_Coach wrote:Question...How many hours of skill development does MM give the kids in between full ice games?

I ask this because most associations only have 2 hours per week for mites and there is no argument that can support spending any of that time on full ice games when the kids could be spending those 2 hours a week on skills.

Not to mention, they play enough games when they get to squirts, peewees and bantams.

My guess, MM has 3 or 4 hours of skill development and SAGs for every 1 full ice game per week.

????
I'm just the guy to answer this question.....

The typical week would look like this (upper level mite league):

3 sessions per week, 2 of which are 1:20 practices (2:40-2:50 per week). Fantastic skill development.

One game per week, two 17:00 minute stop time periods followed by a +- 25:00 running time third period. We have a real ref w/ penalties.

We engage in small area games (SAG) about once per month for about 15 minutes......easily the biggest waste of ice each month.
MN_Hcky_Coach
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Post by MN_Hcky_Coach »

So basically, if an association is practicing for 1 hour and playing a 1 hour full ice game each week (at both the higher and lower level mites), MM is providing almost 3 times the skill development time...no wonder why they develop kids so well.

Any upper level coach, high school, college or pro will tell you that it is the skill development time that puts kids on the right path when they are younger, not the game time. I know top 10 A peewee coaches (2) that do not run forechecking systems and their practices are almost all skill development. These things can be taught at upper levels in no time.

In addition, if MM is providing almost 3 hours of skill development each week, the 4th hour is bonus, and it really sounds like they are already using ADM principles. Where they give a game for the extra ice, the ADM encourages rink rat, creative type hockey as well.

Just curious, is there off ice development going on over there too?
The Huge Hook
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Post by The Huge Hook »

MN_Hcky_Coach wrote:So basically, if an association is practicing for 1 hour and playing a 1 hour full ice game each week (at both the higher and lower level mites), MM is providing almost 3 times the skill development time...no wonder why they develop kids so well.

Any upper level coach, high school, college or pro will tell you that it is the skill development time that puts kids on the right path when they are younger, not the game time. I know top 10 A peewee coaches (2) that do not run forechecking systems and their practices are almost all skill development. These things can be taught at upper levels in no time.

In addition, if MM is providing almost 3 hours of skill development each week, the 4th hour is bonus, and it really sounds like they are already using ADM principles. Where they give a game for the extra ice, the ADM encourages rink rat, creative type hockey as well.

Just curious, is there off ice development going on over there too?
I'm not a big off-ice guy at this age. To answer your question, there is NO off ice instruction.

It is all skill development, on the ice. You don't even play a game until a month + of practices have been completed. They DO NOT use any ADM principles, much more based on Russian (somebody apparently read a book) stuff. I'm pretty happy regarding the decision to leave the Assoc., I hope there are no reprecussions(sp).

The dirty little secret is that, if you are the Head Coach, it is also cheaper than association hockey (at least where I live).
Ugottobekiddingme
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Post by Ugottobekiddingme »

O-townClown wrote:
silentbutdeadly3139 wrote:What is an ADM rep :? I admit I'm not an expert or long seasoned veteran but thats appears to be the problem : some are rules others are recommendations and people are confusing them. You can see it with the comments on this and other threads, people are saying, thinking or hoping things like RW&B are rules and going by the letter of the rule.
http://www.admkids.com/regionalManagers.php

Your ADM rep is Guy Gosselin. These folks are charged with spreading the word. Ours is often in our state, showing kids, parents, coaches, and hockey directors the benefits of incorporating RW&B hockey into their curriculum.

1/2 of Colorado, most of New York, parts of Massachusetts, and possibly some other areas have adopted an "all in" approach. We have not. I posted the phase-in Pittsburgh plan in another thread. My impression is that Minnesota has been slow to change, and I don't mean that in a bad way at all.

Using a mega-association like Edina as an example, their Termite program was basically clinic style and the first two years of Mites relied heavily on crossice or half-ice games. Do they really need to change alot when they are most of the way there?

A topic of discussion at the USA Hockey Winter Meeting two weeks ago was parents taking players outside of an affiliate as a way to get around the hardline ADM mandate chosen by some areas. (I call this "Mite flight") Minnesota doesn't have flight issues because of the residency requirement. I suppose a St. Paul area kid could enroll in Hudson, but doesn't Wisconsin have residency requirements for many of their levels? (I know their Tier I runs differently.)

If Guy Gosselin is anything like Scott Paluch, our ADM rep, I think you'll find him supportive of any and all ideas that are incorporating these principles. Swing the pendulum in the other direction and you won't be able to count on his support.

For those that haven't seen it, the newest RW&B hockey brochure is beyond outstanding. I can't seem to find a copy online. Also, the brochure covering all the ADM is quite good too. http://www.admkids.com/pdf/ADMGuide_2011.pdf

It is recommended that people watch the Dr. Norris video. http://www.admkids.com/media.php

Only when people (parents, coaches, hockey directors) get a shared understanding of what USA Hockey is trying to do can we begin to have an intelligent discussion. When exchanges often go like this...

Guy A: I don't like it.
Guy #2: What don't you like about it?
A: I dunno. I just don't like it. Why change?

...you can see there is a lot of work to be done.

Sometimes Guy A says, "I watched a Mite game the other day and the kids had no trouble with *fillintheblank*." This is true. I see those games all the time. First, there is nothing wrong with the oldest and most experienced playing some big-boy hockey in my book. My guess is it won't die. Even for the strict adherents like Colorado, who's to say there won't be a Spring option that lets the kids play a half-dozen games? Second, while there may be nothing wrong with it, what if the goal is to have a wave of Americans that are better than Parise, Pavelski, Kane, and whoever else? My suspicion is that we have to train the brain to make faster decisions from a very young age. I don't see how full ice games for 6 and 7-year-olds do that.

I don't see Minnesota having a mandate. Interesting that the affiliate presidents voted overwhelmingly to have a nationwide mandate from USA Hockey. (It was just a straw poll to gauge interest, nothing more.) Affiliates don't like getting caught in the middle. They'd rather have more concrete direction from above.
Great...now I find out the "clown" is only a sales guy from Forida trying to sell video and training programing to USA Hock and MN hock. RW&B concepts, ADM, and LTAD principles would benefit the Red, White, and Blue in what way? There is tons of Hockey experience in this state yet there is always someone willing to sell some swamp land...nice. :roll:
O-townClown
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Post by O-townClown »

Ugottobekiddingme wrote:Great...now I find out the "clown" is only a sales guy from Forida trying to sell video and training programing to USA Hock and MN hock. RW&B concepts, ADM, and LTAD principles would benefit the Red, White, and Blue in what way? There is tons of Hockey experience in this state yet there is always someone willing to sell some swamp land...nice. :roll:
1982 was a fun draft.

You are right. There are a lot of experienced hockey people from Minnesota. Jim Johannson is one. He now has pretty much all of USA Hockey's guys reporting into him. Guy Gosselin is another. He's the ADM rep for your area. It'll be great when you have your conversations with them; I'm sure they're anxious for your opinion.

Drafted several rounds before them is one of this board's big (hint) posters. He's an outspoken critic of USA Hockey, the American Development Model, RW&B, and a few other things too. Kind of young to be this cynical, no?

Worth noting is that, while not a Minnesotan, the #2 selection that year was Brian Bellows. He's been, at times, a real whipping boy on the forum.

Oh the irony: another Gosselin was selected (netminder from Quebec), as well as another Johannson (this guy a Swede).

Todd Bergen was extremely promising in 14 NHL games, scoring an impressive 11 goals. ADM tie - wait for it.... - multi-sport athlete growing up! His agent orchestrated a holdout after a stomach injury and threatened the North Stars that his client would leave to pursue a career in professional golf. (I don't think that worked out too well.)

Aaron Ness' dad (or maybe uncle?) was taken, as was the son of Mean Gene. Tom Ward, whose program at Shattuck-St. Mary's is pretty much the embodiment of LTAD thoughts that late teens should increase the intensity and frequency of their training, also was selected in a later round.

Even though you don't like it, Minnesotans are a big part of the USA Hockey leadership. Kinda hard to pin blame on people from other areas if that's what you want to do.
Be kind. Rewind.
Ugottobekiddingme
Posts: 325
Joined: Wed Apr 07, 2010 9:53 pm

Post by Ugottobekiddingme »

O-townClown wrote:
Ugottobekiddingme wrote:Great...now I find out the "clown" is only a sales guy from Forida trying to sell video and training programing to USA Hock and MN hock. RW&B concepts, ADM, and LTAD principles would benefit the Red, White, and Blue in what way? There is tons of Hockey experience in this state yet there is always someone willing to sell some swamp land...nice. :roll:
1982 was a fun draft.

You are right. There are a lot of experienced hockey people from Minnesota. Jim Johannson is one. He now has pretty much all of USA Hockey's guys reporting into him. Guy Gosselin is another. He's the ADM rep for your area. It'll be great when you have your conversations with them; I'm sure they're anxious for your opinion.

Drafted several rounds before them is one of this board's big (hint) posters. He's an outspoken critic of USA Hockey, the American Development Model, RW&B, and a few other things too. Kind of young to be this cynical, no?

Worth noting is that, while not a Minnesotan, the #2 selection that year was Brian Bellows. He's been, at times, a real whipping boy on the forum.

Oh the irony: another Gosselin was selected (netminder from Quebec), as well as another Johannson (this guy a Swede).

Todd Bergen was extremely promising in 14 NHL games, scoring an impressive 11 goals. ADM tie - wait for it.... - multi-sport athlete growing up! His agent orchestrated a holdout after a stomach injury and threatened the North Stars that his client would leave to pursue a career in professional golf. (I don't think that worked out too well.)

Aaron Ness' dad (or maybe uncle?) was taken, as was the son of Mean Gene. Tom Ward, whose program at Shattuck-St. Mary's is pretty much the embodiment of LTAD thoughts that late teens should increase the intensity and frequency of their training, also was selected in a later round.

Even though you don't like it, Minnesotans are a big part of the USA Hockey leadership. Kinda hard to pin blame on people from other areas if that's what you want to do.
Whoa...Clown...I'm still evaluating the neighborhood kids skating ability on the pond and implementing ADM towards their future skating experience. I was pleased to see two break away and preform the "iron lotus" without bodily consequence. Keep the sales process going...as they say...there is a sucker born every minute. Good luck with your efforts and MN hockey.
InigoMontoya
Posts: 1716
Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2009 12:36 pm

Post by InigoMontoya »

[quoteTom Ward, whose program at Shattuck-St. Mary's is pretty much the embodiment of LTAD thoughts that late teens should increase the intensity and frequency of their training, also was selected in a later round.[/quote]

Because SSM skates the kids every day in very intense hockey atmosphere, they're a poster program for ADM? That's quite a stretch. If that's the case, so is Duluth East bantam program, and many others, that'll put in a couple hundred hours of practice and play over 70 games - they've bought into the idea of intensity and frequency of training.
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