2010 Bloomington Midwest Holiday (PW A Tourney) 12/28-1/1/11

[frederick61]

This happened in BIG 3, the Olympic size rink with a large seating capacity. The ref never talked to the fans before the incident, he may have talked to the coach. I wasn't paying attention to that which should tell you that Rosemount fans weren't being rowdy.

[hockey_is_a_choice]

Several years ago, in Canada, the refs skated over to our first-year squirt team’s bench at the end of the period and chatted with our coaches. Subsequently, the coaches turned towards the stands and gestured to the biggest dad in the stands (6’3”, 230+ pounds) to come over to the bench. The coaches asked the big dad to go tell a loud mouth dad to leave the arena. The big dad, in turn, walked over to the smallest dad in the stands (5’8”, 160 lbs) and asked the smaller-sized dad to help him convince the loud mouth dad to leave the arena. My friend, the smaller dad, is a West Point graduate. After taking care of business, Mr. West Point told me that he “would do it again for kicks and giggles.”

I was impressed with how the problem dad was handled. The refs made the problem the coaches’ problem. The coaches, in turn, used their parent resources wisely. There’s a lot to be said for peer pressure. The big mouth dad left the arena without a scene and no penalties were assessed.

The refs in the Rosemount/Prior Lake game should be banned from all remaining games in the tournament.

[B-Ville Hockey Guy]

Just wanted to thank all of the people at BIG including the Medic in the way that they handled the Player injured at the end of the Burnsville/Highland game. He is doing well with no serious damage done to the tendons in his wrist. I hope they got the ice cleaned up prior to the next game. )

[SoftMitts]

Did Lakeville N really beat Rosemount 7 to 0? Or did they get the score backwards and Rosemount won?

[hockeysmart]

Did Lakeville N really beat Rosemount 7 to 0? Or did they get the score backwards and Rosemount won?

They got the score backwards. Rosemount won 7-0.

[tjkhavgam]

The Apple Valley/Marquette game ended in a 3-3 tie.

One interesting note about the Rosemount/Prior Lake game, the winning goal was scored with about two minutes left in the game. Prior Lake scored the goal just as coincidental Rosemount penalties ended. The Lakers had a 5 on 3 advantage.

The coincidental penalties were called late in the game. The first was the result of some contact between two players, the call going against Rosemount. The second however was called immediately after the first. A ref called the penalty against a few Rosemount fans in the stands who had been needling the refs with words like "keep it in your pocket".

After the ref made the first penalty call, he had heard enough. He skated over to the stands in front of the Rosemount fans and told them a penalty would be assessed, skated over to the Rosemount bench and got a player. The Rosemount fans said nothing after that.

I have never seen that happen personally in all the hockey games I have attended. I have seen refs throw fans out of the stands for being rowdy and abusive. So I am torn about the refs behavior.

I had sat next to the Rosemount fans the ref addressed all game. They were persistent in objections to the calls that went against their team, but not overly abusive (no swearing, no personal attacks on the refs, just things like keep it in your pocket). Am I missing something?

Fred, No matter how the refs are doing, no need for parent involvement. They need to just sit and watch and enjoy. There is a reason these 40 year old refs are still reffing peewee games, there not that good. If the Rosemount parents think they could do any better they should take the test and if they pass, jump in. I noticed you sitting in the B,ville section last night any problem with their parents?

[ctbrow1]

http://www.bloomingtonhockey.com/page/s ... nament[url]


Here is the most recent scores and standings.

This is the way I see things shaking out tomorrow:

1. Woodbury vs. 1. Thunder Bay
2. Prior Lake vs. 7. Jefferson
3. Burnsville vs. 6. Kennedy
4. Roseville vs. 5. Rosemount

9. Spring Lake Park vs. 10. Highland
11. Lakeville North vs. 12. Eastview
13. Marquette vs. 14. Apple Valley
15. Champlin vs. 16. Arvada


Spring Lake Park, Lakeville North, Apple Valley and Champlin come out the winners.

I feel the top 8 part of the tournament comes down to Burnsville and Rosemount, with Burnsville taking it all.

On a side note, hats off to the Burnsville coach that applied the pressure to the boys arm when it was gashed. That was a very scary injury. As well as, to the BIG staff and EMTs on staff. An excellent job was done by all.

[MN_Hcky_Coach]

Is there a problem with D6 refs?

We've had them before and they always seem to put on a show/parade to the box, but usually for both teams.

[woodley]

The Apple Valley/Marquette game ended in a 3-3 tie.

One interesting note about the Rosemount/Prior Lake game, the winning goal was scored with about two minutes left in the game. Prior Lake scored the goal just as coincidental Rosemount penalties ended. The Lakers had a 5 on 3 advantage.

The coincidental penalties were called late in the game. The first was the result of some contact between two players, the call going against Rosemount. The second however was called immediately after the first. A ref called the penalty against a few Rosemount fans in the stands who had been needling the refs with words like "keep it in your pocket".

After the ref made the first penalty call, he had heard enough. He skated over to the stands in front of the Rosemount fans and told them a penalty would be assessed, skated over to the Rosemount bench and got a player. The Rosemount fans said nothing after that.

I have never seen that happen personally in all the hockey games I have attended. I have seen refs throw fans out of the stands for being rowdy and abusive. So I am torn about the refs behavior.

I had sat next to the Rosemount fans the ref addressed all game. They were persistent in objections to the calls that went against their team, but not overly abusive (no swearing, no personal attacks on the refs, just things like keep it in your pocket). Am I missing something?

Fred, No matter how the refs are doing, no need for parent involvement. They need to just sit and watch and enjoy. There is a reason these 40 year old refs are still reffing peewee games, there not that good. If the Rosemount parents think they could do any better they should take the test and if they pass, jump in. I noticed you sitting in the B,ville section last night any problem with their parents?

Some of the 40+ refs are doing the games because they aren't very good, others of us still really enjoy being involved in the game. It doesn't matter to me if I work a Squirt/U10 or a U14/Bantam, the teams will get my best effort. I do recognize that it is a job and my consumers (players, coaches, and fans) have a right to expect me to work hard. That doesn't mean I will always be right, none of us are. But it does mean I will skate to be in proper position to make the call.

The higher speed games should be reffed by those that can keep up. Often this means younger men and women. It's sad when you see an older ref making penalty calls from 85 feet or calling a "no goal" from the blue line. Doesn't mean it's time to leave, just take your experience to a lower level and have a positive impact on younger players!! Especially at the younger levels, the more experienced refs have an opportunity to teach. I can't tell you the number of times I've skated a squirt to the box and explained the difference between a stick lift and a hook.

Just like the coach in your association who has coached the PeeWee B team for 30 years because he has a love for the game and the kids, there are several of us refs out there going into our golden years still working appropriate level games for the love of the game and the kids!!

[InigoMontoya]

@Survey - This would allow the bench minor if the Coach did not cooperate with the ref's attempt to control the fans, not just the direct behavior of the fan.

So in the case cited by Frederick, the coach would have had to have refused to do anything to control the fans.

Incorrect: the rule states "1. Ask the coach(es) to control their spectators." The coach is not being asked to "do anything to control the fans"; he is being asked to "control" them. If he cannot control them - bench minor.

[woodley]

@Survey - This would allow the bench minor if the Coach did not cooperate with the ref's attempt to control the fans, not just the direct behavior of the fan.

So in the case cited by Frederick, the coach would have had to have refused to do anything to control the fans.

Incorrect: the rule states "1. Ask the coach(es) to control their spectators." The coach is not being asked to "do anything to control the fans"; he is being asked to "control" them. If he cannot control them - bench minor.

C'mon Inigo. . . keep reading the rule cited by Survey (which must be Minnhock as it is NOT USA which is the certifying body, couldn't find my MN guide book). . .

1. Ask the coach(es) to control their spectators. 2. Ask the coach(es) to request specified individuals to leave the arena.

#2 puts the onus on the coach to act.

Bottom line, a bench minor assessed for fan behavior is bush league!! The only time I can think where it might be appropriate is if the coach or players are inciting the fans to act and that certainly is not what Fred described.

[InigoMontoya]

Some of the 40+ refs are doing the games because they aren't very good, others of us still really enjoy being involved in the game.

I've noticed a lot more adult-officiated games at lower levels. There used to be a pretty large chance you'd see a 14 year old kid reffing a squirt B, peewee C, or 10UB game. Very rarely are the youngsters out there any more; most often two adults reffing a 10UB game. Why is that? Do the old guys need the money? I know several peewee and bantam aged refs that have only reffed a game or two this year - and not of their own choosing.

[woodley]

Some of the 40+ refs are doing the games because they aren't very good, others of us still really enjoy being involved in the game.

I've noticed a lot more adult-officiated games at lower levels. There used to be a pretty large chance you'd see a 14 year old kid reffing a squirt B, peewee C, or 10UB game. Very rarely are the youngsters out there any more; most often two adults reffing a 10UB game. Why is that? Do the old guys need the money? I know several peewee and bantam aged refs that have only reffed a game or two this year - and not of their own choosing.

Absolutely agree w/ you. I always enjoy working with young refs at these levels. It seems to give balance and is a great way for these newer refs to get their feet wet. It's a shame if the young refs are not getting games.

[Juggernaut]

quarter finals
Burnsville over Jefferson
Woodbury over Thunder bay
Roseville over Kennedy
Rosemount up on Prior lake going into the 3rd

Tomorrow is looking like:
Burnsville vs Roseville
Woodbury vs Rosemount

[Juggernaut]

Rosemount wins over Woodbury
Burnsville wins over Roseville

3rd place game:
Woodbury vs Roseville
Championship game:
Burnsville vs Rosemount

[Juggernaut]

Championship:
Rosemount over Burnsville 4-2 with an empty netter.