Association involvement in summer hockey

HockeyDad41 · Post by **HockeyDad41** » Mon Sep 27, 2010 4:39 pm

Maybe greybeard can help with this question:

With more and more kids wanting to play summer hockey and with all of the issues/controversy with AAA programs, would MH ever consider an association based summer hockey program?

Also, if there is no chance of official involvement, how far can an association go unofficially to support a summer AAA program?

Ugh · Post by **Ugh** » Tue Sep 28, 2010 8:49 am

If my son's association became involved in summer hockey I would look for a third alternative - dealing with the association's ineptitude from October to February is already more than I care to deal with.

Pudda_Puck_In_Her_Ear · Tue Sep 28, 2010 9:03 am

... quite agreed Ugh.

Besides, I find the varying angle in coaching styles to be a win / win for the kids. It's also good for kids to see beyond their little city and meet / play with kids from varying locations and backgrounds. Fishbowling associations like that could just make bad situations much much worse. Also, if you get stuck with an idjit coach in association / summer hockey you only have to deal with it short term rather than year round.

InigoMontoya · Post by **InigoMontoya** » Tue Sep 28, 2010 9:44 am

It's hard enough as it is to organize a spring or fall MASH team with a bunch of kids from the same winter program without the association politics ruining it. Good grief, don't give them the idea that they should actually be in charge of it.

Quasar · Post by **Quasar** » Tue Sep 28, 2010 9:48 am

You can't be serious !!!

HockeyDad41 · Post by **HockeyDad41** » Tue Sep 28, 2010 10:02 am

Quasar wrote:You can't be serious !!!

Relax. I'm not advocating anything, just asking a couple of questions. I have heard that a couple of AAA programs in my area are basically made up of complete A teams from single associations and wondered if the associations could/would/can have an active role.

Quasar · Post by **Quasar** » Tue Sep 28, 2010 10:40 am

HockeyDad41 wrote:
Quasar wrote:You can't be serious !!!
Relax. I'm not advocating anything, just asking a couple of questions. I have heard that a couple of AAA programs in my area are basically made up of complete A teams from single associations and wondered if the associations could/would/can have an active role.

Okay, I'm relaxed.. I know of a couple of summer teams that are coached by association coaches. They naturally draw upon as many kids from their association as possible. I think most associations frown on this practice, because it muddies up the selection process for association A teams. In fact in one case they got rid of the coach that ran a summer program.. I would assume that this is not uncommon.

Even though I advocate for Tier 1 hockey within Minnesota hockey associations, I would want it to be during the regular winter season. Never
in the summer unless it was part of an overall program. I also think that within five years AAA for profit hockey will solve the problem.. Then the associations won't have to worry about it. They will be tier 2 as they claim now because all the tier 1 kids skating in the big associations will be skating tier 1 AAA in some for profit club....

Just my opinion.

observer · Post by **observer** » Tue Sep 28, 2010 10:56 am

Just my opinion.

Thankfully.

Quasar · Post by **Quasar** » Tue Sep 28, 2010 11:37 am

observer wrote:
Just my opinion.
Thankfully.

Thank you ... Have a nice day

icnet01 · Post by **icnet01** » Tue Sep 28, 2010 12:26 pm

Pretty sure spring hockey was created to get away from the association philosophy

JoltDelivered · Post by **JoltDelivered** » Tue Sep 28, 2010 4:27 pm

I think you guys are missing one angle here. Association based summer hockey doesn't have to be a AAA team. Heck, it doesn't have to be a team at all. I know there are summer programs run by association coaches that are strictly focused on training. Both on ice and dry land. And enrollment in these programs is restricted to kids only from that particular association.

Skill development, strength and quickness can be a focus without playing games or having a formal team. However, where I think that model breaks down is most parents have been conditioned that summer hockey is about all-star teams or "Specially Selected" teams that play in high profile tournaments. Most winter associations don't take their teams to Chicago, Toronto or Edmonton. So your only vehicle for getting there is a summer AAA hockey team.

JoltDelivered · Post by **JoltDelivered** » Tue Sep 28, 2010 4:30 pm

icnet01 wrote:Pretty sure spring hockey was created to get away from the association philosophy

Actually I would disagree with that. Spring hockey, like summer hockey, was created for two reasons:

Winter hockey ends in March so there is a demand for more and there's money to made. I don't think Showcase started their spring league to offer a different philsophy.

HockeyDad41 · Post by **HockeyDad41** » Tue Sep 28, 2010 5:08 pm

If a group of Squirt A (or pee wee or any level really) kids from one association skated together in a AAA format in the summer, they might not make the best AAA team, but it seems to me that they might have an advantage come winter season. For that reason I wonder if some association coaches/members are being forced to change their opinion or are at least forced to think about it differently.

Quasar · Post by **Quasar** » Tue Sep 28, 2010 5:31 pm

HockeyDad41 wrote:If a group of Squirt A (or pee wee or any level really) kids from one association skated together in a AAA format in the summer, they might not make the best AAA team, but it seems to me that they might have an advantage come winter season. For that reason I wonder if some association coaches/members are being forced to change their opinion or are at least forced to think about it differently.

Two schools of thought on this HD. One is that kids benefit from skating under different coaches, and systems. The other is that kids that stay together fare better as they move up in age.. For what it's worth, I coached in a small association in the mid 70's We only had enough kids for one squirt team we called it an A team and got started. This group of kids played together through High school. Nine of them played college hockey, and one got a couple of shifts in the NHL. I guess it's pretty hard to argue against kids playing together as long as possible. May not be possible now a days with the number of kids etc. But I can tell you from experience . It works.

spin-o-rama · Post by **spin-o-rama** » Tue Sep 28, 2010 9:13 pm

Quasar wrote: For what it's worth, I coached in a small association in the mid 70's We only had enough kids for one squirt team we called it an A team and got started. This group of kids played together through High school. Nine of them played college hockey, and one got a couple of shifts in the NHL.

There's your selling point for Wisconsin Made Hockey!

Quasar · Post by **Quasar** » Tue Sep 28, 2010 9:28 pm

spin-o-rama wrote:
Quasar wrote: For what it's worth, I coached in a small association in the mid 70's We only had enough kids for one squirt team we called it an A team and got started. This group of kids played together through High school. Nine of them played college hockey, and one got a couple of shifts in the NHL.
There's your selling point for Wisconsin Made Hockey!

Yes I know ..And agree. If anyone can build a club from the ground up, and keep the kids together from Mites to Bantams, They will be hard to beat.
So far it seems that pettiness and hissy fits are holding some people back, but I'm sure this too will pass.

icnet01 · Post by **icnet01** » Tue Sep 28, 2010 9:56 pm

JoltDelivered wrote:
icnet01 wrote:Pretty sure spring hockey was created to get away from the association philosophy
Actually I would disagree with that. Spring hockey, like summer hockey, was created for two reasons:

Winter hockey ends in March so there is a demand for more and there's money to made. I don't think Showcase started their spring league to offer a different philsophy.

Spring hockey had a healthy nonprofit following long before the for profit organizations seen the potentials.

JoltDelivered · Post by **JoltDelivered** » Tue Sep 28, 2010 11:26 pm

icnet01 wrote:
JoltDelivered wrote:
icnet01 wrote:Pretty sure spring hockey was created to get away from the association philosophy
Actually I would disagree with that. Spring hockey, like summer hockey, was created for two reasons:

Winter hockey ends in March so there is a demand for more and there's money to made. I don't think Showcase started their spring league to offer a different philsophy.
Spring hockey had a healthy nonprofit following long before the for profit organizations seen the potentials.

Maybe 20 years ago...but in recent years there is no such thing as non-profit following. It's all about the mighty dollar now.

Doglover · Post by **Doglover** » Thu Oct 07, 2010 9:39 am

I guess somethings never change - ridiculous topic.

BadgerBob82 · Post by **BadgerBob82** » Thu Oct 07, 2010 2:13 pm

Q: "I guess it's pretty hard to argue against kids playing together as long as possible."

As long as you start with the right 10 kids!

HockeyDad41 · Post by **HockeyDad41** » Thu Oct 07, 2010 7:16 pm

Doglover wrote:I guess somethings never change - ridiculous topic.

Agreed, some things (that's two words genius) never change.

roundhead · Post by **roundhead** » Thu Oct 07, 2010 9:26 pm

JoltDelivered wrote:
icnet01 wrote:
JoltDelivered wrote: Actually I would disagree with that. Spring hockey, like summer hockey, was created for two reasons:

Winter hockey ends in March so there is a demand for more and there's money to made. I don't think Showcase started their spring league to offer a different philsophy.
Spring hockey had a healthy nonprofit following long before the for profit organizations seen the potentials.
Maybe 20 years ago...but in recent years there is no such thing as non-profit following. It's all about the mighty dollar now.

Absolutely incorrect...

old goalie85 · Post by **old goalie85** » Fri Oct 08, 2010 2:52 pm

It's nice to change parents every six months.

JoltDelivered · Post by **JoltDelivered** » Fri Oct 08, 2010 3:09 pm

roundhead wrote:
JoltDelivered wrote:
icnet01 wrote: Spring hockey had a healthy nonprofit following long before the for profit organizations seen the potentials.
Maybe 20 years ago...but in recent years there is no such thing as non-profit following. It's all about the mighty dollar now.
Absolutely incorrect...

Please elaborate

roundhead · Post by **roundhead** » Fri Oct 08, 2010 7:03 pm

JoltDelivered wrote:
roundhead wrote:
JoltDelivered wrote: Maybe 20 years ago...but in recent years there is no such thing as non-profit following. It's all about the mighty dollar now.
Absolutely incorrect...
Please elaborate

www.MavsHockey.com NON-Profit.

HighSchoolHockeyForums.com

Association involvement in summer hockey

Association involvement in summer hockey

Non-Profit AAA Groups...

Re: Non-Profit AAA Groups...

Re: Non-Profit AAA Groups...