Are goalies important?
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startsinthenet
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Are goalies important?
Need some help in gaining some perspective on the importance of girl Goalies vs girl Players. We see all of these terriffic training facilities such as The Brooks training center at the super rink and other areanas. These faciities are terriffic and reasonable in cost, but leaves the goalie watching through the window. When is somebody going to acknowledge that a goalie needs to train to improve like players and not at $100 a session, but at a reasonalbe cost. If anyone has any suggestions on where to find some reasonable goalie training throughout the year I'd appreciate the input.
Are Goalies Important
Good luck!! Goalie camps, clinics and one on one session along with equipment is expensive!!
I agree with your comments only if you have a very elite goalie a goalie can improve a lot - especially the girl goaltenders doing programs like Herb Brooks Training Center and Total Hockey. They develop speed, athletic ability and use of their stick - most girls are not using their sticks to become a 6th attacker like the HS boys do becuase they don't know how to use them or practice using them. Tell them what you want to develop and both can customize or help.
Other options that are reasonable - Steve Guider the Blaine coach runs an very outstanding summer goalie program - has developed about 9 D1 goalies. Bill Howard the Wisconsin men's goalie coach runs a great program in Woodbury over three days - truly outstanding - he has probably sent more goalies to the NHL than any other college coach.
Does your HS have a dedicated coach working with the goalies? This is a critical development step. It is usually a volunteer but can really show great improvement with on ice and off ice work. If your HS coach is only occassionaly shooting pucks on the goalie ask if they can have someone come on the ice 2-3 times a week and watch/video a few games.
Other options that are reasonable - Steve Guider the Blaine coach runs an very outstanding summer goalie program - has developed about 9 D1 goalies. Bill Howard the Wisconsin men's goalie coach runs a great program in Woodbury over three days - truly outstanding - he has probably sent more goalies to the NHL than any other college coach.
Does your HS have a dedicated coach working with the goalies? This is a critical development step. It is usually a volunteer but can really show great improvement with on ice and off ice work. If your HS coach is only occassionaly shooting pucks on the goalie ask if they can have someone come on the ice 2-3 times a week and watch/video a few games.
As they always say, "the most important position on the ice is goalie." Unfortunately, the goalies tend to be left on their own too often, at all levels. My recommendation would be to look for a synthetic ice facility like a Puck Masters, that has goalie specific training sessions. Sessions run about $45 an hour, and can really help a goalie build the quality repetitions needed to make proper form fluid, and second nature.
Having watched my niece, and dozens of other goalies, including Chanda Gunn, train on the plastic, under the watchful eye of an experienced coach, you can really see the difference in development. Obviously the fundamentals are mastered, but the ability to make corrections to the small things, such as glove and stick positioning, or whether a player is keeping their weight too far back/forward as they slide can have a huge impact on their play.
Once a week during the season, and then bi/tri-weekly during the off-season will have a far greater impact on their development than spending a week at a camp in the summer.
Having watched my niece, and dozens of other goalies, including Chanda Gunn, train on the plastic, under the watchful eye of an experienced coach, you can really see the difference in development. Obviously the fundamentals are mastered, but the ability to make corrections to the small things, such as glove and stick positioning, or whether a player is keeping their weight too far back/forward as they slide can have a huge impact on their play.
Once a week during the season, and then bi/tri-weekly during the off-season will have a far greater impact on their development than spending a week at a camp in the summer.
Totally agree - the goalie position is very specialized and requires specialize training. My son is doing what you described with a coach in a Southern suburb. He has the same set-up you describe above and my son has flourished under his instruction. I think a 1 on 1 coach is very important but make sure you find one that fits your kids needs and style. Experiment with what works best a for you at the younger ages but then try to find consistant methods of instruction in HS. The one on one instruction is also great from a mentor/student point of view. Sometimes a simple phone conversation with your instructor can put the confidence back in your game or help with simple mechanical adjustments. A one on one instructor knows the strengths and weaknesses of their pupil while a goalie camp or factory fails to individualize what works best for the pupil.Hux wrote:As they always say, "the most important position on the ice is goalie." Unfortunately, the goalies tend to be left on their own too often, at all levels. My recommendation would be to look for a synthetic ice facility like a Puck Masters, that has goalie specific training sessions. Sessions run about $45 an hour, and can really help a goalie build the quality repetitions needed to make proper form fluid, and second nature.
Having watched my niece, and dozens of other goalies, including Chanda Gunn, train on the plastic, under the watchful eye of an experienced coach, you can really see the difference in development. Obviously the fundamentals are mastered, but the ability to make corrections to the small things, such as glove and stick positioning, or whether a player is keeping their weight too far back/forward as they slide can have a huge impact on their play.
Once a week during the season, and then bi/tri-weekly during the off-season will have a far greater impact on their development than spending a week at a camp in the summer.
These instructors are like that "good baby sitter"....you don't want to let your neighbors know. We have been fortunate because our instructor has told us to keep our mouth shut and not give his name out. He takes on only a limited number of students and does not want to make a business out of it. He selects the players he wants to work with. This guy has the sport and the position's development as his top priority and not the $$$
fighting all who rob or plunder
Sorry he would eliminate my son if I told you....of course than there would be an open spothockeya1a wrote:So does anyone have names they are willing to share?
if you are new to the goalie thing how do you find these people?
Does your association have a goalie trainer? If so attend his sessions and see how she like the group instruction. Approach that person and see if you can arrangements for that person to work with her during team practices
We just lucked out - We had a great experience last year with our association goalie instructor. My son asked him to assist him in a couple of team practices and evaluate some of his games. They hit it off. The season ended. We were planning another summer camp, but then a friend of the instructor who I was out with on St. Patricks day asked if my son wanted 1on1 training because this guy had an opening and enjoyed working with my son.....the rest is history, pure luck for us.
I would agree with Hux and try to find someone using the synthetic surface. Keeps costs down and adds a great component to footwork because it really requires you have correct technique and transfer weight and balance properly.
We considerderd Stauber but I didn't want to afford it, nor could I afford the long term commitment the program requires to be effective.
Good luck - there are some great goalie coaches out there that do not necessarily believe in one way is the absolutley best way.
fighting all who rob or plunder
Camps and Individual Instruction
My daughter has attended Carrol (good basic stuff fairly cheap) and Stauber (great one on one, video tape evaluation, psyc training and conditioning). She has also attended the MGHCA Freshman Sophmore camp and she said the coach from Blaine was outstanding. She also attended the Minnesota Hockey Peterson Elite camp at Blaine this year and thought it was a great experience. Her advisor and instructor was Hanlon from the U and she thought she was great!
What was interesting about the Peterson camp was she felt her technique was out dated or out of style. She claimed that almost every goalie at the camp was either being trained one on one by an instructor or the high school hired a goalie coach. I guess we are a little lucky in that our head coach was a goalie and spends time every practice with the two rostered goalies so while not one on one - they do get instruction.
Where are these 1 on 1 coaches - I'm not sure but they are out there and like a couple of posters have stated you just sort of stumble into them or the come find you!
You might think about going on the Minnesota Hockey or MNSHL site and posting an ad for a 1 on 1 instructor or talk to your high school coach. These guys actually do talk and if they know of someone who's good and looking for some extra cash they usually can help.
Someone else mentioned stick handling for Girl Goalies - hear hear! Be agressive and let's teach these girls to stick handle and use those boards and the glass to get some nice break outs!
What was interesting about the Peterson camp was she felt her technique was out dated or out of style. She claimed that almost every goalie at the camp was either being trained one on one by an instructor or the high school hired a goalie coach. I guess we are a little lucky in that our head coach was a goalie and spends time every practice with the two rostered goalies so while not one on one - they do get instruction.
Where are these 1 on 1 coaches - I'm not sure but they are out there and like a couple of posters have stated you just sort of stumble into them or the come find you!
You might think about going on the Minnesota Hockey or MNSHL site and posting an ad for a 1 on 1 instructor or talk to your high school coach. These guys actually do talk and if they know of someone who's good and looking for some extra cash they usually can help.
Someone else mentioned stick handling for Girl Goalies - hear hear! Be agressive and let's teach these girls to stick handle and use those boards and the glass to get some nice break outs!
You also have to be very careful about who does the coaching. I have seen and heard numerous examples of coaches who are old school, and do not understand the Pro Fly (butterfly) style that is used today. This is not to say that knowing how to do a two pad stack isn't useful, but tending net now is not the same as it was 20 years ago.
Case in point: A local high school hired a noted goalie coach from years ago to work with the team. The guy told the players not to use the butterfly to make a save on a shot from the high slot, but to use a kick save instead. So rather than having a large wad of foam absorbing shot, the kids were taking shots off their $500 dollar skates, and priceless ankles. Lost on the "coach" was the fact that the new skates have lower cowlings, and less padding on the inside, and in several cases the kids took shots off the ankle.
So aside from reducing the potential stopping area from three square feet (one leg pad), to less than 9 square inches (your average foot), he increased the potential for injury exponentially. Other little tid bits include placing the stick blade flush across your feet when against the post, rather than perpendicular to the outside foot to block a tight cross crease pass etc.
So you really have to watch who is doing the instructing, and what they are actually instructing.
Case in point: A local high school hired a noted goalie coach from years ago to work with the team. The guy told the players not to use the butterfly to make a save on a shot from the high slot, but to use a kick save instead. So rather than having a large wad of foam absorbing shot, the kids were taking shots off their $500 dollar skates, and priceless ankles. Lost on the "coach" was the fact that the new skates have lower cowlings, and less padding on the inside, and in several cases the kids took shots off the ankle.
So aside from reducing the potential stopping area from three square feet (one leg pad), to less than 9 square inches (your average foot), he increased the potential for injury exponentially. Other little tid bits include placing the stick blade flush across your feet when against the post, rather than perpendicular to the outside foot to block a tight cross crease pass etc.
So you really have to watch who is doing the instructing, and what they are actually instructing.
wow - very old old school!Hux wrote:You also have to be very careful about who does the coaching. I have seen and heard numerous examples of coaches who are old school, and do not understand the Pro Fly (butterfly) style that is used today. This is not to say that knowing how to do a two pad stack isn't useful, but tending net now is not the same as it was 20 years ago.
Case in point: A local high school hired a noted goalie coach from years ago to work with the team. The guy told the players not to use the butterfly to make a save on a shot from the high slot, but to use a kick save instead. So rather than having a large wad of foam absorbing shot, the kids were taking shots off their $500 dollar skates, and priceless ankles. Lost on the "coach" was the fact that the new skates have lower cowlings, and less padding on the inside, and in several cases the kids took shots off the ankle.
So aside from reducing the potential stopping area from three square feet (one leg pad), to less than 9 square inches (your average foot), he increased the potential for injury exponentially. Other little tid bits include placing the stick blade flush across your feet when against the post, rather than perpendicular to the outside foot to block a tight cross crease pass etc.
So you really have to watch who is doing the instructing, and what they are actually instructing.
fighting all who rob or plunder
According to USA hockey, Goaltenders pads will be reduced to 11 inches for the 2008-2009 season, however it is recommend that goaltenders switch this year. Not sure if high school is following this, but I would imagine they are. Also, I often check the hockey shops online about various products and it seems most goal pads have already been switched to 11 inches by most if not all manufacturers.
I have heard for HS it ill be 2009-2010 season. Nothing that I have had confirmed though. I hope that is correct as my junior has new 12' pads and we bought those based on the fact that he would not be affected in HS by the new ruletheref wrote:According to USA hockey, Goaltenders pads will be reduced to 11 inches for the 2008-2009 season, however it is recommend that goaltenders switch this year. Not sure if high school is following this, but I would imagine they are. Also, I often check the hockey shops online about various products and it seems most goal pads have already been switched to 11 inches by most if not all manufacturers.
A lot of goalies have been switching regardless of the rule, feeling that 1) they would be used to the pads when they made the switch to college, and 2) a majority felt they were a bit more mobile with the reduced width pads.davey wrote:I have heard for HS it ill be 2009-2010 season. Nothing that I have had confirmed though. I hope that is correct as my junior has new 12' pads and we bought those based on the fact that he would not be affected in HS by the new ruletheref wrote:According to USA hockey, Goaltenders pads will be reduced to 11 inches for the 2008-2009 season, however it is recommend that goaltenders switch this year. Not sure if high school is following this, but I would imagine they are. Also, I often check the hockey shops online about various products and it seems most goal pads have already been switched to 11 inches by most if not all manufacturers.
Actually, you don't want to look for one on one coaching, as in private lessons. The best way to train, as far as learning and having fun, is in a small group. At our local synthetic puck stopping emporium they often use multiple nets and rotate the kids through, which allows them to work on the same drill from head on, and both sides and then take a rest, or to work on different things in a station type of setting and then take a rest.Puck Bag wrote: Where are these 1 on 1 coaches - I'm not sure but they are out there and like a couple of posters have stated you just sort of stumble into them or the come find you!
You might think about going on the Minnesota Hockey or MNSHL site and posting an ad for a 1 on 1 instructor or talk to your high school coach. These guys actually do talk and if they know of someone who's good and looking for some extra cash they usually can help.
Someone else mentioned stick handling for Girl Goalies - hear hear! Be agressive and let's teach these girls to stick handle and use those boards and the glass to get some nice break outs!
Working in a group is also great for doing mirror drills, particularly when you have a more experienced goalie in the group who can lead the way and the others can mimic form.
I'm surprised the renowned coach from Blaine doesn't have a synthetic facility. Given his track record of turning out D1 goalies, he could make a killing instructing in this manner. (or maybe he does and no one outside of a select few know about it.
)Hux I think the one on one is great but needs to be based on the age of the goalie, where they are in their training, and what type of focus in training they need. It has worked out great for my son this year.Hux wrote:.
Actually, you don't want to look for one on one coaching, as in private lessons. The best way to train, as far as learning and having fun, is in a small group. At our local synthetic puck stopping emporium they often use multiple nets and rotate the kids through, which allows them to work on the same drill from head on, and both sides and then take a rest, or to work on different things in a station type of setting and then take a rest.
Working in a group is also great for doing mirror drills, particularly when you have a more experienced goalie in the group who can lead the way and the others can mimic form.
Here is a note he got from his coach tonight as he prepares for HS tryouts next week
"Try-outs are no more or no less than a measure of what you know and what you can do.
Just like a test in school or taking your drivers test, if you are prepared an have done your homework things will go great.
You and I together have done your homework and you are prepared to excel. The only thing to remind you is to play with your heart and your head for the love of hockey, totally commit to being the best goalie you can. Leave nothing to chance.
Put all this together every time you step on the ice and be as great as I know you are."
my son is currently in the garage working on some stickhandling homework his coach gave him ....without any encouragement from me.
fighting all who rob or plunder
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startsinthenet
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thanks so far for all of the comments, really wanted to get my daughter to Guider this summer but the schedule didnt work. This year it will be a priority! Participated in CODP this summer, great experience; Marci and Lenny are terriffic she will participate again, goalie concentration could be stronger though. I know they are working on improving. Anyone have any feedback on Adam Houser's summer program?... Also to the point of 11" pads, I don't know when they will be made manditory, but my daughter hasn't skated in anything but! One lesson I did learn from an old school pro was dont give up a loss of any potential quickness a 12" pad may deliver. Since she has always played in 11" they could change tomorrow and it wont matter. Also 11" are usually in the intermediate class and it saves a few $$$ I'm sure the rest of you goalie parents can relate, saved $$$ are rare thing in the goalie world.
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dmbenough2Bagoalie
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Good goalie camp at a good price
I know it's tough to find good camps for kids wanting to play goal without paying an arm and a leg but there are a few. My recomendation is try the E.G.F. goalie camp which is held in june. It's headed by karl goehring (former UND star and NHL player) He has a very hands on camp there with several other goaltenders from area colleges and it was a very well run camp. Probably the best price i've seen around.
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big_thurst
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