Hill Murray Pioneers

Sparlimb · Post by **Sparlimb** » Mon Jan 16, 2012 8:26 pm

hockeymannorth wrote:
Sparlimb wrote:If you want HB's stats against the good teams, look at the other half of their schedule where they played all top 10 teams. Roseau's coach called her the best in the world at her age. That's heady praise. She reminds me of Kyle Rau from EP last year, just that little bit better when it really matters. We'll see if her season ends as well as Rau's did last year.
there is no other half only played 2 top teams stillwater and minnetonka, they beat a down stillwater and split with minnetonka but iam not saying HB is not a good player but many top players would score good stats against most teams Hill plays and Roseau lost to all city teams they played so maybe she's the best player he's seen from the 3 city teams they played

Well I'm not going to argue against you with schedule. I can consider it a top schedule, you can call them all cupcakes. I don't much care. They do have the highest strength of schedule of anyone in their section. If you really are from the north, you should respect that they come up and play the northern teams (as I think is important for the city teams to do). You point out a split with Tonka, but not the fact their main gun was out. They did beat Tonka the first time, but only by one, so it is a pretty even match with HB out there. HM has made state all of once, and it was on the shoulders of HB last year. They are no shoe-in to make it this year as they are still in one of the hardest sections (6AA is comparable if not harder). HM still gets a shot at BSM, which I'll be at to see where they stand with another of the state's best. I'm even happier to see she'll be a gopher. I get to cheer for her for another 4 years...

MinnGirlsHockey · Post by **MinnGirlsHockey** » Tue Jan 17, 2012 12:53 am

hockeymannorth wrote:there is no other half only played 2 top teams stillwater and minnetonka

I think you're also missing top teams Breck, Warroad, and Edina, whom they've already played. Their SOS is currently#14 out of 120 (see http://www.bgoski.com/KRACH_SOS.htm). I wouldn't call that only playing 2 top teams.

iceage · Post by **iceage** » Tue Jan 17, 2012 6:09 am

observer wrote:
The referees assign the assists, it is not the teams.
Come on, you're smarter than that. On the ice yes, but what gets entered on the Hub and in the newspaper is different. I too am for getting it correct but some teams do pump up their numbers.

If you are saying that teams make wholesale changes to the stats after the game, then you are privy to information that most of us don't have. Perhaps you would like to share some of your statistics and knowledge.

iceage · Post by **iceage** » Tue Jan 17, 2012 8:32 am

iceage wrote:
observer wrote:
The referees assign the assists, it is not the teams.
Come on, you're smarter than that. On the ice yes, but what gets entered on the Hub and in the newspaper is different. I too am for getting it correct but some teams do pump up their numbers.
If you are saying that teams make wholesale changes to the stats after the game, then you are privy to information that most of us don't have. Perhaps you would like to share some of your statistics and knowledge.

I stand corrected. I received some off-line info and I wasn't aware that the problem was larger than it is. We certainly didn't do it but that was quite a few years ago. Perhaps the culture has changed. This is my last posdt on the subject.

hockeymannorth · Post by **hockeymannorth** » Tue Jan 17, 2012 8:57 am

MinnGirlsHockey wrote:
hockeymannorth wrote:there is no other half only played 2 top teams stillwater and minnetonka
I think you're also missing top teams Breck, Warroad, and Edina, whom they've already played. Their SOS is currently#14 out of 120 (see http://www.bgoski.com/KRACH_SOS.htm). I wouldn't call that only playing 2 top teams.

your Krach sos also ranked Breck at #40 and Benilde-st Maragets #8 they are 1 or 2 in overall ranking for sure,

MinnGirlsHockey · Post by **MinnGirlsHockey** » Tue Jan 17, 2012 10:33 pm

hockeymannorth wrote:
MinnGirlsHockey wrote:
hockeymannorth wrote:there is no other half only played 2 top teams stillwater and minnetonka
I think you're also missing top teams Breck, Warroad, and Edina, whom they've already played. Their SOS is currently#14 out of 120 (see http://www.bgoski.com/KRACH_SOS.htm). I wouldn't call that only playing 2 top teams.
your Krach sos also ranked Breck at #40 and Benilde-st Maragets #8 they are 1 or 2 in overall ranking for sure,

I'm not exactly sure what you're trying to say. You're right -- BSM is #1 in the Overall KRACH rankings and Breck is #2 (see the 'OA RK' column in the SOS list or http://www.bgoski.com/KRACH_OA.htm). I was just pointing out that H-M's Strength of Schedule ranking is very respectable at #14 - i.e. they have not been playing a bunch of cupcakes....

hockeymannorth · Post by **hockeymannorth** » Wed Jan 18, 2012 6:43 pm

MinnGirlsHockey wrote:
hockeymannorth wrote:
MinnGirlsHockey wrote: I think you're also missing top teams Breck, Warroad, and Edina, whom they've already played. Their SOS is currently#14 out of 120 (see http://www.bgoski.com/KRACH_SOS.htm). I wouldn't call that only playing 2 top teams.
your Krach sos also ranked Breck at #40 and Benilde-st Maragets #8 they are 1 or 2 in overall ranking for sure,
I'm not exactly sure what you're trying to say. You're right -- BSM is #1 in the Overall KRACH rankings and Breck is #2 (see the 'OA RK' column in the SOS list or http://www.bgoski.com/KRACH_OA.htm). I was just pointing out that H-M's Strength of Schedule ranking is very respectable at #14 - i.e. they have not been playing a bunch of cupcakes....

Krach said your rankingsin strength will only count against better teams because you should beat the patsies on your schedule so a team like Hill the 6 better teams they play push them up on strength but losing to a patsie team like Simley would really hurt in overall rankings and overall is their main goal

hockeymannorth · Post by **hockeymannorth** » Thu Jan 19, 2012 11:15 am

hockeymannorth wrote:
MinnGirlsHockey wrote:
hockeymannorth wrote:your Krach sos also ranked Breck at #40 and Benilde-st Maragets #8 they are 1 or 2 in overall ranking for sure,
I'm not exactly sure what you're trying to say. You're right -- BSM is #1 in the Overall KRACH rankings and Breck is #2 (see the 'OA RK' column in the SOS list or http://www.bgoski.com/KRACH_OA.htm). I was just pointing out that H-M's Strength of Schedule ranking is very respectable at #14 - i.e. they have not been playing a bunch of cupcakes....
Krach said your rankingsin strength will only count against better teams because you should beat the patsies on your schedule so a team like Hill the 6 better teams they play push them up on strength but losing to a patsie team like Simley would really hurt in overall rankings and overall is their main goal. tartan 78 simley73 henry sibley 63 mahtomedi 64 all play the same confrence and play Hill twice but Hill gets alot higher ranking

hckynut12 · Post by **hckynut12** » Thu Jan 19, 2012 4:06 pm

[/quote]Krach said your rankingsin strength will only count against better teams because you should beat the patsies on your schedule so a team like Hill the 6 better teams they play push them up on strength but losing to a patsie team like Simley would really hurt in overall rankings and overall is their main goal. tartan 78 simley73 henry sibley 63 mahtomedi 64 all play the same confrence and play Hill twice but Hill gets alot higher ranking[/quote]

Is anyone else as confused as I am about where this is going???? HM plays as tough a non-conference schedule as possible year in and year out, they really can't much help the conference they are in. In Fact, they have offered in the past to some of their conference members to play only once (for 4 points instead of 2) to allow each team to find an opponent more suitable to their caliber of play. To my knowledge only Richfield (in past years) accepted this offer. Let's face it, every conference has it's weaker teams. Woodbury (Krach rating of 1.611), Forest Lake (4.007), and East Ridge (6.594) all play in the Suburban East Conference with Roseville, and they play each other twice, so what's the point????

oag · Post by **oag** » Thu Jan 19, 2012 6:15 pm

In my opinion, there should be no discussion of whether or not Hannah Brandt is a talented, proven hockey player/scorer. Anyone who has watched her play knows she is.

If you want to have an interesting discussion on strength of schedule and rankings, maybe we should move to Anoka's #2 (#3 Krach) ranking given their schedule.

They have one impressive win against Minnetonka - first game of the season - and have played only 1 other team in the top 10 - Elk River - who also hasn't won against other top 10 teams.

Anoka has a very good team, and some very good skaters, but the number 2 ranking seems unearned at this point.

hockeymannorth · Post by **hockeymannorth** » Thu Jan 19, 2012 8:13 pm

oag wrote:In my opinion, there should be no discussion of whether or not Hannah Brandt is a talented, proven hockey player/scorer. Anyone who has watched her play knows she is.

If you want to have an interesting discussion on strength of schedule and rankings, maybe we should move to Anoka's #2 (#3 Krach) ranking given their schedule.

They have one impressive win against Minnetonka - first game of the season - and have played only 1 other team in the top 10 - Elk River - who also hasn't won against other top 10 teams.

Anoka has a very good team, and some very good skaters, but the number 2 ranking seems unearned at this point.

i think HB is a good player i think she carry's Hill on her back without her Minnetonka owned them they couldn't mount any offense in kapisoa tourny as for Anoka they are 18-1-1

oag · Post by **oag** » Thu Jan 19, 2012 9:29 pm

I do understand Anoka has only lost 1, and tied 1. And, like I said, I know they beat Minnetonka the first game of the season.

Since that time Minnetonka has beaten Warroad, Roseau, Andover, Roseville (without their best), H-M (without their best), lost lost to BSM (1) and Hill-Murray (2), and tied Edina.

Anoka has a win vs Elk River/Zimmerman, an OT win vs Andover, an OT win vs Blaine, an OT win vs Maple Grove, an OT win vs Robbinsdale-Armstrong-Cooper, and a TIE with Centennial

I did say they are a very good team. My question is what might their record be if they had played any of the other top 10 teams? Can you give me more of an argument than "Anoka is 18-1-1"?

Sparlimb · Post by **Sparlimb** » Thu Jan 19, 2012 9:47 pm

oag wrote:I do understand Anoka has only lost 1, and tied 1. And, like I said, I know they beat Minnetonka the first game of the season.

Since that time Minnetonka has beaten Warroad, Roseau, Andover, Roseville (without their best), H-M (without their best), lost lost to BSM (1) and Hill-Murray (2), and tied Edina.

Anoka has a win vs Elk River/Zimmerman, an OT win vs Andover, an OT win vs Blaine, an OT win vs Maple Grove, an OT win vs Robbinsdale-Armstrong-Cooper, and a TIE with Centennial

I did say they are a very good team. My question is what might there record be if they had played any of the other top 10 teams? Can you give me more of an argument than "Anoka is 18-1-1"?

The real question is which questionable record earns the #1 seed in 5AA. Anoka or Irondale? Irondale will only lose one more game, to BSM. Anoka could easily lose a game or two along the way but may not. I guess I'd have to say Anoka because they did beat Minnetonka which is a quality win. Being a former Irondale girls hockey dad though, I'll be pulling for them in sections...

ayhfan · Post by **ayhfan** » Fri Jan 20, 2012 12:10 am

The real question is which questionable record earns the #1 seed in 5AA. Anoka or Irondale? Irondale will only lose one more game, to BSM. Anoka could easily lose a game or two along the way but may not. I guess I'd have to say Anoka because they did beat Minnetonka which is a quality win. Being a former Irondale girls hockey dad though, I'll be pulling for them in sections...

oag Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2012 9:29 pm Post subject:

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I do understand Anoka has only lost 1, and tied 1. And, like I said, I know they beat Minnetonka the first game of the season.

Since that time Minnetonka has beaten Warroad, Roseau, Andover, Roseville (without their best), H-M (without their best), lost lost to BSM (1) and Hill-Murray (2), and tied Edina.

Anoka has a win vs Elk River/Zimmerman, an OT win vs Andover, an OT win vs Blaine, an OT win vs Maple Grove, an OT win vs Robbinsdale-Armstrong-Cooper, and a TIE with Centennial

I did say they are a very good team. My question is what might their record be if they had played any of the other top 10 teams? Can you give me more of an argument than "Anoka is 18-1-1"?

Wins over Cloquet, Eagan and Chaska in the Eden Prarie Tourney to go along with a win over S St. Paul. Add that to the fact they play in one of the tougher conferences. Anoka should be ranked up there. Teams that may not be ranked out of this conference are very good-Andover, Blaine and Centennial could play with anyone on any night. Much tougher conference then Irondales!! No way Irondale should be ranked higher.

Silent But Deadly · Post by **Silent But Deadly** » Fri Jan 20, 2012 8:23 am

We've played BSM, Tonka, Edina, NWC, Andover, Wayzata, Hopkins, EP, MG and played Anoka last night.....based on last night....Anoka deserves to be up near the top. In addition, 10th grade Blair Parent is the real deal....at least last night!

MNHockeyFan · Post by **MNHockeyFan** » Fri Jan 20, 2012 9:35 am

Silent But Deadly wrote:We've played BSM, Tonka, Edina, NWC, Andover, Wayzata, Hopkins, EP, MG and played Anoka last night.....based on last night....Anoka deserves to be up near the top. In addition, 10th grade Blair Parent is the real deal....at least last night!

They showed two of Anoka's goals on KARE11's sports segment last night, including a real beauty by Parent. Even Randy Shaver was very impressed!

Here's a link that shows all of the game's scores:

http://www.kare11.com/video/14032439090 ... -Buffalo-1

Bandy · Post by **Bandy** » Fri Jan 20, 2012 1:53 pm

ayhfan wrote: Wins over Cloquet, Eagan and Chaska in the Eden Prarie Tourney to go along with a win over S St. Paul. Add that to the fact they play in one of the tougher conferences. Anoka should be ranked up there. Teams that may not be ranked out of this conference are very good-Andover, Blaine and Centennial could play with anyone on any night. Much tougher conference then Irondales!! No way Irondale should be ranked higher.

KRACH Strength of Schedule supports your statements.
http://www.bgoski.com/KRACH_SOS.htm

oag · Post by **oag** » Fri Jan 20, 2012 4:36 pm

Bandy wrote:
ayhfan wrote: Wins over Cloquet, Eagan and Chaska in the Eden Prarie Tourney to go along with a win over S St. Paul. Add that to the fact they play in one of the tougher conferences. Anoka should be ranked up there. Teams that may not be ranked out of this conference are very good-Andover, Blaine and Centennial could play with anyone on any night. Much tougher conference then Irondales!! No way Irondale should be ranked higher.
KRACH Strength of Schedule supports your statements.
http://www.bgoski.com/KRACH_SOS.htm

I'm not trying to bash Anoka. I agree that they should be ranked first in their section. I'm just wondering if anyone can point me to a signature win, apart from the first night of the season that warrants a #2 ranking. Because when they make it to state, it might matter.

I don't want to bash Cloquet, Eagan or Chaska either - but why would a win over Cloquet go "a long way" toward validating Anoka? For instance, Cloquet lost to Wayzata who is 0-6 in the Lake conference. And Chaska is a good, feisty team, but they also have not beaten a top 10 team. Eagan beat LV North in OT, and lost to LV South 6-0. My point is this, I don't see how wins over Cloquet, Eagan and Chaska justify a #2 ranking.

Should Anoka be ranked #2?

MNHockeyFan · Post by **MNHockeyFan** » Fri Jan 20, 2012 10:37 pm

oag, just wondering who would you rank ahead of Anoka, and why?

ayhfan · Post by **ayhfan** » Sat Jan 21, 2012 1:06 am

oag wrote:
Bandy wrote:
ayhfan wrote: Wins over Cloquet, Eagan and Chaska in the Eden Prarie Tourney to go along with a win over S St. Paul. Add that to the fact they play in one of the tougher conferences. Anoka should be ranked up there. Teams that may not be ranked out of this conference are very good-Andover, Blaine and Centennial could play with anyone on any night. Much tougher conference then Irondales!! No way Irondale should be ranked higher.
KRACH Strength of Schedule supports your statements.
http://www.bgoski.com/KRACH_SOS.htm
I'm not trying to bash Anoka. I agree that they should be ranked first in their section. I'm just wondering if anyone can point me to a signature win, apart from the first night of the season that warrants a #2 ranking. Because when they make it to state, it might matter.

I don't want to bash Cloquet, Eagan or Chaska either - but why would a win over Cloquet go "a long way" toward validating Anoka? For instance, Cloquet lost to Wayzata who is 0-6 in the Lake conference. And Chaska is a good, feisty team, but they also have not beaten a top 10 team. Eagan beat LV North in OT, and lost to LV South 6-0. My point is this, I don't see how wins over Cloquet, Eagan and Chaska justify a #2 ranking.

Should Anoka be ranked #2?

Seeing that the NWS conf has 6 teams in the top 10 of the SOS shows they and the others in the conf play a difficult schedule. Some teams in the Conference in the middle as well as those teams above, Chaska,Eagan etc should/could be very difficult to get by come section time. Some sections will crown a champ after playing only 1 tough game. Should they be #2 yes and who cares.

oag · Post by **oag** » Sat Jan 21, 2012 2:06 am

MNHockeyFan wrote:oag, just wondering who would you rank ahead of Anoka, and why?

Without question, Roseville. Lost 2 and tied 1 without their best players. Tied Edina - top 10 team. Longer, more random reasoning...Roseville beat Mounds View 9-1 and 5-2; Mounds View beat Elk River, some of Anoka's toughest competition, 1-0.

Without question, Hill-Murray. Hill played, LV-S, Breck, Minnetonka, Stillwater, EP, Warroad, Roseau, and Edina and lost once. I certainly could be wrong, but given Anoka's list of OT wins, I don't think they would have a chance to come out of that stretch with only 1 loss.

Minnetonka, though I know some would disagree. In a previous post I listed their accomplishments since the early loss to Anoka. I think if they played again this week, Tonka wins.

It's a farther stretch, but I also believe I could make a good case for Lakeville South and North, and even Edina (though their record wouldn't impress anyone). If Anoka played those three teams right now, and I was giving my pick, I'd say all 3 would beat Anoka in fairly close games.

It might not say much, but since Anoka has played only Minnetonka on my list, look at common opponents:

Lakeville South beat Eagan 6-0; Anoka won 5-2. Lakeville South beat Coon Rapids 6-0; Anoka won 4-3. I don't see a case for Anoka @ #2 while LV-S is #9.

ayhfan wrote that "Andover, Blaine and Centennial could play with anyone on any night". And I don't disagree that they are decent teams, but Anoka wins against those teams don't give them much credibility in my book because...

Centennial lost to Hopkins 0-4; Hopkins has lost to Minnetonka, Lakeville North and Edina twice (tied them once). They have won 1 game in the Lake Conference. Cenntennial also lost to Rosemount who was beaten by, Tonka, LV-S and LV-N (3 times).

Andover - Both Minnetonka and Edina beat Andover. Andover lost to Buffalo 5-1, but Buffalo lost to Benilde 10-1, Minnetonka 5-0, and Edina 6-3.

Done for good with this discussion. I'm not out to get any of those teams, and I think the competition all over is much closer this year. I just wondered if others felt the same about Anoka's high ranking. I think the answer is "no".

DmanDad1980 · Post by **DmanDad1980** » Sat Jan 21, 2012 8:55 am

oag

Using the "comparing score" merry-go-round is not a very good validation... Teams are missing players, don't play as well on a night to night basis, and so on and so on...

Anoka has one loss. They play a top strength of schedule. They play in arguably a top 2 conference in the State of hockey... OT or regulation, they just win, thats the facts...

At this snap shot in time, they deserve the #2 spot in the polls...

hockeyheaven · Post by **hockeyheaven** » Mon Jan 23, 2012 7:47 am

For those who would like a break from this riveting speculation

... below is a link to a wonderful piece done by the MN Wild regarding Ms Brandt. For those of us who have had the pleasure of witnessing this extraordinary young lady grow into not only the player she is, but the person she is… will enjoy this immensely. Really puts into perspective how fast this time goes. Kind of make all the other stuff seem somewhat insignificant...well atleast for the moment

http://video.wild.nhl.com/videocenter/c ... &id=151380

iceage · Post by **iceage** » Mon Jan 23, 2012 9:52 am

hockeyheaven wrote:For those who would like a break from this riveting speculation ... below is a link to a wonderful piece done by the MN Wild regarding Ms Brandt. For those of us who have had the pleasure of witnessing this extraordinary young lady grow into not only the player she is, but the person she is… will enjoy this immensely. Really puts into perspective how fast this time goes. Kind of make all the other stuff seem somewhat insignificant...well atleast for the moment

http://video.wild.nhl.com/videocenter/c ... &id=151380

I really enjoyed that.......thanks for posting it.

Nordic · Post by **Nordic** » Mon Jan 23, 2012 3:18 pm

I would say yes Anoka does deserve it, if it was anyone else in that spot, someone whould question that also. The unknown, and maybe just by me, is who is the group who places the teams, and what do they use to do that? Anoka plays in a tough NWC and many teams could have beat them, and did not. That speaks alone. The question is, will they make it out of the section on top? I think they may be worried about that. In section 5AA, I know of 5 teams in the section that could beat Anoka in one game, 3 don't have much of a chance. It will be interesting to see.
But, many of the top 5 rated teams could sit in any of the positions and should be happy about it. Let the girls play the games and we shall see. Thanks,