Moderators: Mitch Hawker, east hockey, karl(east)
Voltaire never posted here. He's inconsequential.elliott70 wrote:packerboy wrote: I do not agree with what he says but defend to the death his right to say it. (I just made that up....well, first I heard that Voltaire said it and then I made it up.)
Voltaire, is he not the father of electricity?????
Some people have less options than others.BIAFP wrote:It is really pretty simple.........if you don't like your job, pay, benefits....Quit. If you are really worth more, it shouldn't be to difficult to find a better job. If not, shut up and get to work.
What he said may have been his opinion, but it was a true insult to Chris. I think the Board rules say something about that. It crossed the line. I can't be any clearer than that.packerboy wrote:Lee, thats a real opinion. You think he is the only one who feels that way.
Is it harsh?
Sure but darn it, its not something that hasnt been said before and believe me thare are a lot of people who think the controllers got just what they deserved.
Same with the MLB umpires. A lot of hem lost their jobs and people said 'good riddens'.
Not only is hockeygods attitude shared by a lot of a lot of people but insitutions have done exactly as he suggets.
I dont agree with him but ...hey, we now have Johnson grads using 5 dollar words...what could be more surprising. I think we can safely assume that the old Governor didnt learn that word unil he was out of high school.
elliott70 wrote:BIAFP wrote:It is really pretty simple.........if you don't like your job, pay, benefits....Quit. If you are really worth more, it shouldn't be to difficult to find a better job. If not, shut up and get to work.
Your life has put you on the other side of the street, but you should still realize that fact.
Life doesn't put you anywhere. Hard work, dedication, personal accountability and a good education do.
I just emailed Mitch and asked him to decide. As I told him, I'm too close to the topic to decide.elliott70 wrote:BIAFP wrote:It is really pretty simple.........if you don't like your job, pay, benefits....Quit. If you are really worth more, it shouldn't be to difficult to find a better job. If not, shut up and get to work.
And Lee and others are right, arrogance in the debate and personal attacks have brought the thread to the point of lock-down, not difference of opinions.
How in the world would you know even what side of the street Bader is on let alone how he got there? You imply he was born with the proverbial golden spoon in his mouth, how would you know? Pretty big leap to assume some decisions made in our lives don't impact our outcomes - it's all in the hands of others I guess.elliott70 wrote:Some people have less options than others.BIAFP wrote:It is really pretty simple.........if you don't like your job, pay, benefits....Quit. If you are really worth more, it shouldn't be to difficult to find a better job. If not, shut up and get to work.
Some peole like their jobs, but have no other method of obtaining what they are worth other than banning together.
Your life has put you on the other side of the street, but you should still realize that fact.
And Lee and others are right, arrogance in the debate and personal attacks have brought the thread to the point of lock-down, not difference of opinions.
In the immortal words of Mel Brooks, "Its good to be King".east hockey wrote: Barring a suitable answer to the question I posed, Yang bans yin. Now that may not be balance, but I call it justice ala "the meek shall inherit the Bored". And in the words of slappy, ain't a thing can be done about it. Other than whine to Mitch. Good luck.
I'm trying to get in mid-season admin form before the season this year.
Lee
4.25% of say 150K is a lot different...then 34K, but I do agree with the performance review issue, you have to work towards set goals that are measurable, and that should be the main basis for pay increases.AngusYoung wrote:How in the world would you know even what side of the street Bader is on let alone how he got there? You imply he was born with the proverbial golden spoon in his mouth, how would you know? Pretty big leap to assume some decisions made in our lives don't impact our outcomes - it's all in the hands of others I guess.elliott70 wrote:Some people have less options than others.BIAFP wrote:It is really pretty simple.........if you don't like your job, pay, benefits....Quit. If you are really worth more, it shouldn't be to difficult to find a better job. If not, shut up and get to work.
Some peole like their jobs, but have no other method of obtaining what they are worth other than banning together.
Your life has put you on the other side of the street, but you should still realize that fact.
And Lee and others are right, arrogance in the debate and personal attacks have brought the thread to the point of lock-down, not difference of opinions.
You guys don't think workers in the private sector have not had to ante up more of their pay to account for rising health care premiums? Wrong - this has impacted all, but I think you would be hard pressed to find private sector annual increases over that 4.25% figure. I know I, as well as employees I supervise, would love to lock in a pay increase of 4.25% with no need for a performance review to validate the increase on. I guess I have to agree with BIAFP on this one - we all have choices and if we are not thrilled with what is being offered for pay at our place of employment, you either need to learn to live with it without bitching or move on to what you consider greener pastures.
AY
AngusAngusYoung wrote:How in the world would you know even what side of the street Bader is on let alone how he got there? You imply he was born with the proverbial golden spoon in his mouth, how would you know? Pretty big leap to assume some decisions made in our lives don't impact our outcomes - it's all in the hands of others I guess.elliott70 wrote:Some people have less options than others.BIAFP wrote:It is really pretty simple.........if you don't like your job, pay, benefits....Quit. If you are really worth more, it shouldn't be to difficult to find a better job. If not, shut up and get to work.
Some peole like their jobs, but have no other method of obtaining what they are worth other than banning together.
Your life has put you on the other side of the street, but you should still realize that fact.
And Lee and others are right, arrogance in the debate and personal attacks have brought the thread to the point of lock-down, not difference of opinions.
You guys don't think workers in the private sector have not had to ante up more of their pay to account for rising health care premiums? Wrong - this has impacted all, but I think you would be hard pressed to find private sector annual increases over that 4.25% figure. I know I, as well as employees I supervise, would love to lock in a pay increase of 4.25% with no need for a performance review to validate the increase on. I guess I have to agree with BIAFP on this one - we all have choices and if we are not thrilled with what is being offered for pay at our place of employment, you either need to learn to live with it without bitching or move on to what you consider greener pastures.
AY
Very nicely stated and puts us back on course.hockeygod wrote:Yes I may be arrogant...I make my living this way and by taking the opposing opinions. I didn't mean to disrespect Chris in anyway but right or wrong. we hire people to do a job for a certain amount of money, if they come to us and say they want more, I have a right to say no. and the have the right to walk away. I still feel unions don't belong in the public sector and thats why I said send them the down the same road as the air traffic controllers. Money is tight, employees are easy to find, If I was advising the strikers I would have told them to get some free education out of the U to better themselves, so that they can get better jobs, instead of tryiing to get money out of the U after a point when budgets have been set. It was a losing situation for the strikers from the start esspecially when the people who pay the taxes are losing there jobs and taking paycuts. I didn't mean any disrespect and I'm sorry if I hurt anyones feelings but I felt this one sided disscussion merited another point of veiw
I don't know the ins-and-outs of their negotiation, but it is that... a negotiation. I would doubt that AFSCME would expect to actually get 4.25%, but I believe that the U is offering 1% - 1.25% increase (based on this proposal). If you would jump at 4.25%, I would imagine you would probably be just as apt to balk at 1%.AngusYoung wrote:How in the world would you know even what side of the street Bader is on let alone how he got there? You imply he was born with the proverbial golden spoon in his mouth, how would you know? Pretty big leap to assume some decisions made in our lives don't impact our outcomes - it's all in the hands of others I guess.elliott70 wrote:Some people have less options than others.BIAFP wrote:It is really pretty simple.........if you don't like your job, pay, benefits....Quit. If you are really worth more, it shouldn't be to difficult to find a better job. If not, shut up and get to work.
Some peole like their jobs, but have no other method of obtaining what they are worth other than banning together.
Your life has put you on the other side of the street, but you should still realize that fact.
And Lee and others are right, arrogance in the debate and personal attacks have brought the thread to the point of lock-down, not difference of opinions.
You guys don't think workers in the private sector have not had to ante up more of their pay to account for rising health care premiums? Wrong - this has impacted all, but I think you would be hard pressed to find private sector annual increases over that 4.25% figure. I know I, as well as employees I supervise, would love to lock in a pay increase of 4.25% with no need for a performance review to validate the increase on. I guess I have to agree with BIAFP on this one - we all have choices and if we are not thrilled with what is being offered for pay at our place of employment, you either need to learn to live with it without bitching or move on to what you consider greener pastures.
AY
Why is that? You certainly have that option, but why would anybody need to do that? People take positions for reasons other than money - maybe not you - but it's commonplace, and to suggest that people stop "bitching" over pay, when there are many other reasons they have they jobs they do, is - to me - another naive and arrogant statement.AngusYoung wrote:we all have choices and if we are not thrilled with what is being offered for pay at our place of employment, you either need to learn to live with it without bitching or move on to what you consider greener pastures.
I managed to steer clear of the Lent thread (you can check... you won't find me). I'm probably going to hell for it, but you guys are way too creative for me and there's no way I could keep up.Can't Never Tried wrote:Oh no!! not already....packerboy wrote:Yup, ashes to ashes, dust to dust.
Ahh, reminds me of Ash Wednesday and the best time of the year.........................Lent.
Govs start the week 2 football thread quick!!...we need a distraction!
Wrong.Knowlzee wrote: Unions have finacially stressed every private industry they have been involved with.
One more quibble; it is actually possible for a form of government to go bankrupt. It's called insolvency and if you knew about Duluth, you'd know that this was being considered a possibilitiy with the City of Duluth. So it isn't quite so simple as you suggest. There are limits to how much taxes, fines and fees can be raised. So that's where that particular situation would end.Knowlzee wrote: The main problem with government unions is the government will not go bankrupt,.....they will simply take more from the people in the form of increased taxes, fines, and fees. When does it end?
