Legs of the Wolf (Tony Scott v. Frederick61)

[BadgerBob82]

First: I said this will be good IF MN Hockey does it right. I still fear MN Hockey will get it wrong. Set back hockey 10 years? OK, a bit extreme.

You are probably right Edina's, Wayzata's, etc are strong programs and will remain strong programs. Not sure if keeping things unchanged would change that? So I fail to see your point.

I guess I fail to see your point on the problems at the A level? But isn't the mega associations stacking B1 teams a problem at the B1 level? I think it is.

The rich getting richer, or the dominate associations continuing to dominate? Would you rather see a proposal that waters down the "mega" associations? If so, I don't know how to make a good association worse, and how that would make things better for you.

As for kids moving to "mega" associations. MN Hockey's residency/waiver rules are so stupid and benefit metro area associations. I can't believe there would be even more association hopping as the mega associations must be getting all the kids they want as it is now?

[stromboli]

I get your position Bo. The "elite" tag is being placed on mega association kids early and you think moving forward only AA team kids will be noticed and tagged as "elite"? Yet who cares if the Machine or Blades only want AA association kids? Or if Advanced 15's are 75% AA association kids. This is the part of your argument I don't understand or agree with.

When I say MN Hockey will probably get it wrong, that is because I think too many special interests will insert their power and alter doing what's right. And it won't be the mega associations as the AA-A format is good for the big program either way. I think the vocal minority, the small association with inferiority complex will create a bunch of loopholes or goofy criteria in hopes of benefitting their own association and that will mess up the whole thing.

You are blinded thinking your kid will be ignored in an A level program. Your ego gets the best of you again!

I'm just looking for an equal opportunity for all kids.

Bring in outside evaluators to an Advanced 15's type program and things would be much different...... If this is what you're getting at..?

"Loopholes" to do what?

Sorry Bo, but you know that equal opportunity is nice in theory, but hard to achieve in practice.

Bigger associations have more resources and often deeper pools of coaches to pick from. They have more kids and can field teams at proper levels. They have more higher end kids due to numbers and have higher competition in tryouts and practices. Their kids are more likely to be seen as they compete for tournament and season championships.

Take the summer analogy if you'd like where it's checkbook hockey and there are no borders. You still have early birth year kids being more likely to be selected for higher AAA summer teams and receive better coaching because they have had more time to grow and develop physically.

You already know all of this.

If you choose to live in a smaller town, you get the good with the less-than-perfect. Association hockey in small towns can be a great experience for the kids, and doesn't need to hold them back. Miska's a good example from your backyard. At the 2000 level, the kid from Luverne is another. However, unless you have really good coaching where you are, be prepared to either supplement that training outside of association hockey year round -- or move. It's that simple. (For my family, the choice to move was made easy by the situation with the schools. The move to 4 days in North Branch sealed it.)

If you're kid has the physical tools and passion to play, and you're looking for an equal shot, and you're not willing to move, then you likely need to work harder than those in a large association to get the same level of training and to be noticed. It's not fair. It's not equal.
On another thread you've started you're looking for D2 examples. Looking at Forest Lake as an option because it's within driving distance for open enrollment? But maybe only if it's AA?

Focus less on the association and its designation. Focus more on individual training to supplement whatever association or summer program your kid is in. That will open more doors than whether he's on an A vs. AA team. That's just my opinion.

I do get your point about B1s and the opportunity to tryout for 15s.

In the end it needs to be more than just about hockey. These kids are too young to get wrapped up in what they might do some day. All we can do is give them opportunities to develop regardless of where we live and help them do the best they can with the opportunities that they're given. Unfortunately, the number of opportunities they recieve isn't always based on their individual talent -- and it isn't equal. It just is. Politics play a part. Relationships play a part.

A couple of questions for you. I looked at last year's highschool rankings. About 1 in 4 of the top 40 were designated "A" versus "AA". And of the "As" there were quite a few privates. How is having two levels in youth hockey that much different than highschool? Should all the kids in As just pack it in? Have all of the really good players in A towns moved to AA towns? Do they all move to privates?

Headed out for the weekend. Have a good one.

[MrBoDangles]

I get your position Bo. The "elite" tag is being placed on mega association kids early and you think moving forward only AA team kids will be noticed and tagged as "elite"? Yet who cares if the Machine or Blades only want AA association kids? Or if Advanced 15's are 75% AA association kids. This is the part of your argument I don't understand or agree with.

When I say MN Hockey will probably get it wrong, that is because I think too many special interests will insert their power and alter doing what's right. And it won't be the mega associations as the AA-A format is good for the big program either way. I think the vocal minority, the small association with inferiority complex will create a bunch of loopholes or goofy criteria in hopes of benefitting their own association and that will mess up the whole thing.

You are blinded thinking your kid will be ignored in an A level program. Your ego gets the best of you again!

I'm just looking for an equal opportunity for all kids.

Bring in outside evaluators to an Advanced 15's type program and things would be much different...... If this is what you're getting at..?

"Loopholes" to do what?

Sorry Bo, but you know that equal opportunity is nice in theory, but hard to achieve in practice.

Bigger associations have more resources and often deeper pools of coaches to pick from. They have more kids and can field teams at proper levels. They have more higher end kids due to numbers and have higher competition in tryouts and practices. Their kids are more likely to be seen as they compete for tournament and season championships.

Take the summer analogy if you'd like where it's checkbook hockey and there are no borders. You still have early birth year kids being more likely to be selected for higher AAA summer teams and receive better coaching because they have had more time to grow and develop physically.

You already know all of this.

If you choose to live in a smaller town, you get the good with the less-than-perfect. Association hockey in small towns can be a great experience for the kids, and doesn't need to hold them back. Miska's a good example from your backyard. At the 2000 level, the kid from Luverne is another. However, unless you have really good coaching where you are, be prepared to either supplement that training outside of association hockey year round -- or move. It's that simple. (For my family, the choice to move was made easy by the situation with the schools. The move to 4 days in North Branch sealed it.)

If you're kid has the physical tools and passion to play, and you're looking for an equal shot, and you're not willing to move, then you likely need to work harder than those in a large association to get the same level of training and to be noticed. It's not fair. It's not equal.
On another thread you've started you're looking for D2 examples. Looking at Forest Lake as an option because it's within driving distance for open enrollment? But maybe only if it's AA?

Focus less on the association and its designation. Focus more on individual training to supplement whatever association or summer program your kid is in. That will open more doors than whether he's on an A vs. AA team. That's just my opinion.

I do get your point about B1s and the opportunity to tryout for 15s.

In the end it needs to be more than just about hockey. These kids are too young to get wrapped up in what they might do some day. All we can do is give them opportunities to develop regardless of where we live and help them do the best they can with the opportunities that they're given. Unfortunately, the number of opportunities they recieve isn't always based on their individual talent -- and it isn't equal. It just is. Politics play a part. Relationships play a part.

A couple of questions for you. I looked at last year's highschool rankings. About 1 in 4 of the top 40 were designated "A" versus "AA". And of the "As" there were quite a few privates. How is having two levels in youth hockey that much different than highschool? Should all the kids in As just pack it in? Have all of the really good players in A towns moved to AA towns? Do they all move to privates?

Headed out for the weekend. Have a good one.

I like the post and communicating with someone with their head on their shoulders. I agree 100+% with your post.
-We were lucky enough to get our kid into a great fit.

-Youth associations have more levels of play than High School

- Yes, in the current system a kid might want to "pack it in" if he wants to get any credit for his play.
*Anders Lee - St Francis to Edina
*Christian Isaackson - Pine City to STA
* Blake Heinrich - Cambridge to Hill
* Joey Benik - St Francis to St Francis.. He was lambasted his whole career and only because he was changing the record books was he given a little credit.
These were some of the biggest names out there the last few years
- I brought up district pooled teams(topic) from small associations a while back... My..how things would change.
They should open up the private sector in the Winter for those that want to develop, if MNH is only about providing a place to play in your community.

There are many confined in the boundaries of third world Hockey in Minnesota.

Have a great weekend!