MSHSL to vote on budget cuts

[HShockeywatcher]

TCQQL, PuckRanger, and others,
I could be wrong here, but I'm guessing the MSHSL isn't suggesting this because they would love to have the season shorter. It's probably because of a financial issue they feel unavoidable. Having the whole state contact them and say they want to keep the season as is won't change the issue.

[goldy313]

Rarely does an ice rink make any money, there is a very good reason that they are public buildings, if they made any money there would be a ton of private rinks around, there aren't. Even the one(s) that are were built with a nice percentage of public money. One of the absolute worst things to happen to hockey was the "Mighty Ducks" program, that gave cities money for rinks to be built but did nothing to help pay for running them thereby increasing the cost to individual hockey players and associations not to mention the municipality that has the rink.

Travel in places like Roseau, Redwood Valley, Ely, and Winona are drastically different from travel costs at Roseville or Minnetonka. The MSHSL needs to regulate things for all, not have a different set of standards for "rich" districts" and "poor" districts.

The MSHSL is not now, never has been, or ever should be concerned about player development. That's not their charge, if that's your goal there are other avenues, don't hold the MSHSL responsible for that.

It was only 2001 when the MSHSL expanded the schedule from 22 to 25 games, going back 3 games isn't that big of deal.

[BSM99]

Going back to 22 games is no big deal? Really? Just ask the kids and the coaches and we'll see if they have the same response.

Should we hold the MSHL responsible for cashing the BIG checks from the state tourney and the section playoffs? - because those numbers are big.

And when revenues dry up from the few sports that bring in some money we can bet they will come with hat in hand to the private sector or to the tax payer. That's a mission they understand and the rest of the sheep who carry their tune.

[Hockeyguy_27]

Going back to 22 games is no big deal? Really? Just ask the kids and the coaches and we'll see if they have the same response.

Should we hold the MSHL responsible for cashing the BIG checks from the state tourney and the section playoffs? - because those numbers are big.

And when revenues dry up from the few sports that bring in some money we can bet they will come with hat in hand to the private sector or to the tax payer. That's a mission they understand and the rest of the sheep who carry their tune.

I like the way you think!

[defense]

Going back to 22 games is no big deal? Really? Just ask the kids and the coaches and we'll see if they have the same response.

Should we hold the MSHL responsible for cashing the BIG checks from the state tourney and the section playoffs? - because those numbers are big.

And when revenues dry up from the few sports that bring in some money we can bet they will come with hat in hand to the private sector or to the tax payer. That's a mission they understand and the rest of the sheep who carry their tune.

I like the way you think!

I'm going to go out on a limb here but I think this issue is way bigger than running a hockey rink and money lost to a few home games that might not happen.....we're probably talking Minnesota state wide...all sports....no its bigger....probably more along the lines of no publicly funded schools have enough money PERIOD. That means for anything.

[EREmpireStrikesBack]

What common sense is that?

Is this your excuse?

[breakout]

How sad, in our sport we pay for the fields to be built. We follow that by renting the fields we built by the hour for inflated prices. Does this happen in football, basketball or lacrosse?

On top of that, we have our kids and parents go out and do fund raisers. A couple hundred dollar athletic fee ............ that is only the beginning.

We do all these things because we love the sport of hockey. Now, they want to pick our pockets and rob us again. As a group, shouldn't we have a problem with this?

Can anyone come up with contact information, phone numbers, emails, etc.?
Let's take it upon ourselves to bombard these people who know little about our sport with hundreds if not thousands of emails and put an end to this.

I did a little checking and Craig Perry is on the Activity, Activity Rules Interpretations and Activity Advisory Committees at MSHSL for Ice Hockey. Here is his email address: cperry@mshsl.org .... It could not hurt to email him and express our concerns.

Folks, the squeeky wheel typically gets oil. I encourage you to send Mr. Perry an email. Copy, paste and send out his contact info to all your hockey buddies and ask them to do the same. He could get bombarded with thousands of emails within a couple of days.

To sit idle and micro analyze this will not solve anything. Additionally, most hockey parents would be willing to step up and pay the difference in game costs ........................ I would.

[breakout]

Just sent my email to Mr. Perry. I hope all of you do the same.

[northwoods oldtimer]

If school districts wanted to cut budgets the best place to start is in the Adminstrative positions. A good examples is Assistant Principals taking in $95,000.00 year and have very little to offer the school district. Private sector cuts dead wieght it is high time the public schools do the same.

[gitter]

How about some common sense use of Title IX? Start with the Girls Hockey Tournament and move it back to Ridder where it belongs. I have no idea the costs, but I would guess Ridder is a hell of a lot less expensive to rent than the Xcel Center.

But, with this day and age where everyone should "win", common sense things get pushed by the wayside, and we end up with situations like the one we are about to encounter.

I'm sure if everyone thought hard enough - you'd find more than my Xcel to Ridder example of wasteful spending in the first place.

[Goldy Gopher]

How about some common sense use of Title IX? Start with the Girls Hockey Tournament and move it back to Ridder where it belongs. I have no idea the costs, but I would guess Ridder is a hell of a lot less expensive to rent than the Xcel Center.

But, with this day and age where everyone should "win", common sense things get pushed by the wayside, and we end up with situations like the one we are about to encounter.

I'm sure if everyone thought hard enough - you'd find more than my Xcel to Ridder example of wasteful spending in the first place.

Couldn't agree more. There will always be that one parent that wants little Sally to have the experience of playing at the X. The girls tourney at Ridder could have a great atmosphere, instead it's at the X with no atmosphere and that's a shame for girls hockey.

[RLStars]

How about some common sense use of Title IX? Start with the Girls Hockey Tournament and move it back to Ridder where it belongs. I have no idea the costs, but I would guess Ridder is a hell of a lot less expensive to rent than the Xcel Center.

But, with this day and age where everyone should "win", common sense things get pushed by the wayside, and we end up with situations like the one we are about to encounter.

I'm sure if everyone thought hard enough - you'd find more than my Xcel to Ridder example of wasteful spending in the first place.

Couldn't agree more. There will always be that one parent that wants little Sally to have the experience of playing at the X. The girls tourney at Ridder could have a great atmosphere, instead it's at the X with no atmosphere and that's a shame for girls hockey.

What does that have to do with local schools districts trying to save money and balance budgets?

[Goldy Gopher]

How about some common sense use of Title IX? Start with the Girls Hockey Tournament and move it back to Ridder where it belongs. I have no idea the costs, but I would guess Ridder is a hell of a lot less expensive to rent than the Xcel Center.

But, with this day and age where everyone should "win", common sense things get pushed by the wayside, and we end up with situations like the one we are about to encounter.

I'm sure if everyone thought hard enough - you'd find more than my Xcel to Ridder example of wasteful spending in the first place.

Couldn't agree more. There will always be that one parent that wants little Sally to have the experience of playing at the X. The girls tourney at Ridder could have a great atmosphere, instead it's at the X with no atmosphere and that's a shame for girls hockey.

What does that have to do with local schools districts trying to save money and balance budgets?

Absolutely nothing, I was just commenting on how it would make more sense to have the girls tourney at Ridder. It's not the first time a thread on this bored has gotten off topic.

[HShockeywatcher]

While money made from ticket sales at games may not go directly to costs, I have to think that better strategic planning of section games. Planning ahead of time is great, but when two teams are both driving a ways to a game, this is extra money spent driving and less ticket revenue. It happens every year.

One example, the semifinals and finals of 5A. If the seeding are (1) SCC, (2) Hermantown, (3) Denfeld, (4) Moose Lake and there are no upsets, the semifinal match ups would be SCC/ML and Hermantown/Denfeld.

Playing either of these games at Cloquet simply makes no sense. Elk River and Grand Rapids meeting in the middle to play at the DECC makes sense. Moose Lake going a half hour north and Cathedral going 2 and a half hours PAST MOOSE LAKE north to meet someone simply doesn't make sense.

Not only does the MSHSL have an opportunity to make a difference economically in the tough times we are in, but making changes like this would simply make sense.

[defense]

While money made from ticket sales at games may not go directly to costs, I have to think that better strategic planning of section games. Planning ahead of time is great, but when two teams are both driving a ways to a game, this is extra money spent driving and less ticket revenue. It happens every year.

One example, the semifinals and finals of 5A. If the seeding are (1) SCC, (2) Hermantown, (3) Denfeld, (4) Moose Lake and there are no upsets, the semifinal match ups would be SCC/ML and Hermantown/Denfeld.

Playing either of these games at Cloquet simply makes no sense. Elk River and Grand Rapids meeting in the middle to play at the DECC makes sense. Moose Lake going a half hour north and Cathedral going 2 and a half hours PAST MOOSE LAKE north to meet someone simply doesn't make sense.

Not only does the MSHSL have an opportunity to make a difference economically in the tough times we are in, but making changes like this would simply make sense.

Do you know where DuLuth Denfield High School and Hermantown High School are located???????

[HShockeywatcher]

defense,
I know exactly where they are located as I have been to both for multiple sporting events. Duluth is approx. 22 miles from Cloquet and Hermantown is also 21 miles from Cloquet. Why should either have to make the 20 mile trip when one could stay in the city they are in and the other make an 8 mile trip to the other? Heck, you could make both play at a neutral site and go to Proctor.

Whatever the choice, my point is to make the location make more sense for both teams involved decreasing driving for everyone involved and probably increasing admission.

Adding a bunch of smiley faces doesn't legitimize your points.

[defense]

defense,
I know exactly where they are located as I have been to both for multiple sporting events. Duluth is approx. 22 miles from Cloquet and Hermantown is also 21 miles from Cloquet. Why should either have to make the 20 mile trip when one could stay in the city they are in and the other make an 8 mile trip to the other? Heck, you could make both play at a neutral site and go to Proctor.

Whatever the choice, my point is to make the location make more sense for both teams involved decreasing driving for everyone involved and probably increasing admission.

Adding a bunch of smiley faces doesn't legitimize your points.

thank you for the tip does that help???

and if 20 miles is going to break the budjet...I hope neither gets to state...

[HShockeywatcher]

thanks for completely missing the point. I made the point with SCC/ML and you choose to comment on Denfeld/Hermantown. No, the Denfeld/Hermantown game being held in Cloquet isn't a huge bank buster, but I will content that in a cheap closer venue they'd make more. The SCC/ML is one example of something that happens all over the state. It happened in football and soccer for state too; the first round match ups happen at a pre-determined neutral site. Many times this neutral site is out of the way for both teams. Waiting until match ups are determined to plan exactly where the game is played makes more sense logistically.

[goldy313]

You have to have the site prearranged, you can't just wait and see who is playing who then try and find a rink, hope there is ice available, and find people to sell and take tickets, sell concessions, etc. based on 24 hours notice or less. No sport runs this way, all are set up up to year in advance if not more.

Also the Administrative section administers the tournament, administrative sections aren't exactly aligned with the hockey sections nor any other sport. There is an awful lot that goes into planning these events, not something that can be done at a days notice. Things such as cost; Marriucci charges in the neighborhood of $10,000 to rent their building in 1AA and 1A they used to play there but lost money and played in an empty environment so they moved to a building that charges around $1000 for the day. Aside from 1 coach in the section the schools seem to like the move, not only is the atmosphere better but the member schools get a nice check returned to them following the tournament, something that dissapeared at Marriucci.

[HShockeywatcher]

My first point in this point is that another issue is the alignment of sections. I think they do a rather good job, but some teams in a section are hundreds of miles from others. That doesn't make sense.

goly313, I figured that point may come up. I didn't want to make my post really long and write about it. I'm not saying to have scramble for facilities last minute. In the first round of state in football, for example, they have 24 different games to play with probably 12 or so different venues. Well, after the match ups are determined, many of the locations could be changed to make more logical locations for the teams involved.

When talking about big arenas that are $10k+ this discussion is different, but the difference in spending/profit in making an arena at a location with more draw would be interesting to find out.

[goldy313]

My first point in this point is that another issue is the alignment of sections. I think they do a rather good job, but some teams in a section are hundreds of miles from others. That doesn't make sense.

goly313, I figured that point may come up. I didn't want to make my post really long and write about it. I'm not saying to have scramble for facilities last minute. In the first round of state in football, for example, they have 24 different games to play with probably 12 or so different venues. Well, after the match ups are determined, many of the locations could be changed to make more logical locations for the teams involved.

When talking about big arenas that are $10k+ this discussion is different, but the difference in spending/profit in making an arena at a location with more draw would be interesting to find out.

Football changed their policy regarding state playoff games this season and given that all games must be played on artificial turf the number of venues possible dropped substantially.

As for spending vs. profit I think that's what the administartive section does, there has to be a break even point or a point at which the loss is acceptable while still providing a good atmosphere for the athletes and fans. I would gather that since the MSHSL league publishes it's budget and you can see exactly what they make and spend (contrary to popular belief) I'm pretty sure that if you asked each section secretary could give you the numbers on their revenue/defict for each sport.[/b]

[wbmd]

The shortening of the season would affect practically all sports. It's just not the hockey season that could be decreased due to budget cuts.

[wbmd]

http://www.mnhockeyhub.com/page/show/32760-home#

[hockeyblitz]

I agree that this is not the solution to cutting back on expenses. Cutting back to 20 games would definitely impact this sport. This is something that would start happening that is already happening in the Southeast (Big 9 Conference). Teams would start playing certain teams in there conference 1 game for four points in order to schedule tougher opponents. This is already going on in the Big 9 as Rochester Mayo and Century plays some of there conference teams only 1 time to allow for better games somewhere else. This I believe would start going on in other conferences that have traditionally weaker teams. I believe this would cause alot of animosity and we should stay away from this.

[hockeyblitz]

Just sent my e-mail to Mr. Perry. Everybody needs to do this.