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Andover 3 Elk River 2 OT

pucklady wrote:Andover 3 Elk River 2 OT

That should make the 7AA seedings a little more interesting.

Lee

east hockey wrote:

pucklady wrote:Andover 3 Elk River 2 OT

That should make the 7AA seedings a little more interesting.

Lee

What's so interesting?
1. East
2. Andover
3. Elk River
4. Rapids
5. Cloquet
6. Flake

Unfortunate for Rapids they don't play Andover, but this seems pretty cut and dry at the moment based on game results, if you ignore margins.
-East beat Rapids, Andover, and Cloquet.
-Andover lost to East but beat ER and CEC.
-Elk River don't play East, lost to Andover, and beat Rapids.
-Rapids lost to both East and ER but beat both Cloquet and Flake.
-Cloquet lost to East and Rapids but beat Flake.

This way there are no teams above a team they lost to. There are a couple match ups here that won't be happening, which is unfortunate, but if the season ended now, this is how it should be. Unless you see something I don't...

HShockeywatcher wrote:

east hockey wrote:

pucklady wrote:Andover 3 Elk River 2 OT

That should make the 7AA seedings a little more interesting.

Lee

What's so interesting?
1. East
2. Andover
3. Elk River
4. Rapids
5. Cloquet
6. Flake

Unfortunate for Rapids they don't play Andover, but this seems pretty cut and dry at the moment based on game results, if you ignore margins.
-East beat Rapids, Andover, and Cloquet.
-Andover lost to East but beat ER and CEC.
-Elk River don't play East, lost to Andover, and beat Rapids.
-Rapids lost to both East and ER but beat both Cloquet and Flake.
-Cloquet lost to East and Rapids but beat Flake.

This way there are no teams above a team they lost to. There are a couple match ups here that won't be happening, which is unfortunate, but if the season ended now, this is how it should be. Unless you see something I don't...

It's not whether I see something you don't (I do in many cases, it's just not worth the effort to debate your circular logic crap), it's whether the coaches see something you don't. But since you're so sure, why not just email your seedings to the 7AA coaches and save them the wasted effort in having a seeding meeting this year? Could save on gas money for them, etc.

Man, you're a pain.

Lee

east hockey wrote:

HShockeywatcher wrote:

east hockey wrote: That should make the 7AA seedings a little more interesting.

Lee

What's so interesting?
1. East
2. Andover
3. Elk River
4. Rapids
5. Cloquet
6. Flake

Unfortunate for Rapids they don't play Andover, but this seems pretty cut and dry at the moment based on game results, if you ignore margins.
-East beat Rapids, Andover, and Cloquet.
-Andover lost to East but beat ER and CEC.
-Elk River don't play East, lost to Andover, and beat Rapids.
-Rapids lost to both East and ER but beat both Cloquet and Flake.
-Cloquet lost to East and Rapids but beat Flake.

This way there are no teams above a team they lost to. There are a couple match ups here that won't be happening, which is unfortunate, but if the season ended now, this is how it should be. Unless you see something I don't...

It's not whether I see something you don't (I do in many cases, it's just not worth the effort to debate your circular logic crap), it's whether the coaches see something you don't. But since you're so sure, why not just email your seedings to the 7AA coaches and save them the wasted effort in having a seeding meeting this year? Could save on gas money for them, etc.

Man, you're a pain.

Lee

Interesting. I asked you a question, you call me a pain and avoiding answering the question

Not sure what's so circular about this logic, seems pretty straight forward to me. So what is it you think the coaches could "see differently me" based on the results thus far?

east hockey wrote:

HShockeywatcher wrote:

east hockey wrote: That should make the 7AA seedings a little more interesting.

Lee

What's so interesting?
1. East
2. Andover
3. Elk River
4. Rapids
5. Cloquet
6. Flake

Unfortunate for Rapids they don't play Andover, but this seems pretty cut and dry at the moment based on game results, if you ignore margins.
-East beat Rapids, Andover, and Cloquet.
-Andover lost to East but beat ER and CEC.
-Elk River don't play East, lost to Andover, and beat Rapids.
-Rapids lost to both East and ER but beat both Cloquet and Flake.
-Cloquet lost to East and Rapids but beat Flake.

This way there are no teams above a team they lost to. There are a couple match ups here that won't be happening, which is unfortunate, but if the season ended now, this is how it should be. Unless you see something I don't...

It's not whether I see something you don't (I do in many cases, it's just not worth the effort to debate your circular logic crap), it's whether the coaches see something you don't. But since you're so sure, why not just email your seedings to the 7AA coaches and save them the wasted effort in having a seeding meeting this year? Could save on gas money for them, etc.

Man, you're a pain.

Lee

I will say it for you Lee. Hey HSHW you are a complete tool!!

East is one other then that your rankings are way off.

northwoods oldtimer wrote:

east hockey wrote:

HShockeywatcher wrote: What's so interesting?
1. East
2. Andover
3. Elk River
4. Rapids
5. Cloquet
6. Flake

Unfortunate for Rapids they don't play Andover, but this seems pretty cut and dry at the moment based on game results, if you ignore margins.
-East beat Rapids, Andover, and Cloquet.
-Andover lost to East but beat ER and CEC.
-Elk River don't play East, lost to Andover, and beat Rapids.
-Rapids lost to both East and ER but beat both Cloquet and Flake.
-Cloquet lost to East and Rapids but beat Flake.

This way there are no teams above a team they lost to. There are a couple match ups here that won't be happening, which is unfortunate, but if the season ended now, this is how it should be. Unless you see something I don't...

It's not whether I see something you don't (I do in many cases, it's just not worth the effort to debate your circular logic crap), it's whether the coaches see something you don't. But since you're so sure, why not just email your seedings to the 7AA coaches and save them the wasted effort in having a seeding meeting this year? Could save on gas money for them, etc.

Man, you're a pain.

Lee

I will say it for you Lee. Hey HSHW you are a complete tool!!

East is one other then that your rankings are way off.

This is where we really need to have an Ignore feature in phpbb. Not that it would help an admin, but it would save people some serious time in reading some of this convulated pap, wouldn't it?

Lee

ER and Andover still have another game with each other. I love the debates not so quick boys....

fiveholenyou wrote:ER and Andover still have another game with each other. I love the debates not so quick boys....

Most opinions would probably put Rapids at #2, but when you line up for section seedings, it is generally said that games against section opponents matter most. They have lost to ER and DE, so they'd be at 3 at the highest. At the moment, Andover beat ER, which puts them above ER.

If ER wins the second match up in regulation, I'd move ER/GR each up a spot and Andover down to 4. But with a couple key match ups not happening (DE/ER and GR/Andover) how do you seed based on anything more than the results of the games played?

Or just continue to not respond

Seen this movie enough times to know it's not good to assume anything. Andover and Elk River don't play enough 7AA games to give the ones they do have enough weight. Just because 7AA games are most important doesn't mean the entire season result isn't in heavy consideration.

northwoods oldtimer wrote:
I will say it for you Lee. Hey HSHW you are a complete tool!!

East is one other then that your rankings are way off.

Interesting to see this tool has come up with the same rankings as our beloved karl has. It must be my circular logic to come around to the same as anyone else would.

rapidsrapids wrote:Seen this movie enough times to know it's not good to assume anything. Andover and Elk River don't play enough 7AA games to give the ones they do have enough weight. Just because 7AA games are most important doesn't mean the entire season result isn't in heavy consideration.

Why is it the responsibility of Andover and Elk River to play those games? It takes two teams to play a game. Regardless of why the game isn't played, it isn't, so you use the games that did happen to evaluate the teams.

I agree, they should play all.

HShockeywatcher wrote:

rapidsrapids wrote:Seen this movie enough times to know it's not good to assume anything. Andover and Elk River don't play enough 7AA games to give the ones they do have enough weight. Just because 7AA games are most important doesn't mean the entire season result isn't in heavy consideration.

Why is it the responsibility of Andover and Elk River to play those games? It takes two teams to play a game. Regardless of why the game isn't played, it isn't, so you use the games that did happen to evaluate the teams.

I agree, they should play all.

They don't play many 7AA games because they're in a conference (the NWSC, with no other 7AA teams than themselves) that fills up their schedule and doesn't leave many non-conference games available. They scheduled as many 7AA teams as they could.

dueling21 wrote:

HShockeywatcher wrote:

rapidsrapids wrote:Seen this movie enough times to know it's not good to assume anything. Andover and Elk River don't play enough 7AA games to give the ones they do have enough weight. Just because 7AA games are most important doesn't mean the entire season result isn't in heavy consideration.

Why is it the responsibility of Andover and Elk River to play those games? It takes two teams to play a game. Regardless of why the game isn't played, it isn't, so you use the games that did happen to evaluate the teams.

I agree, they should play all.

They don't play many 7AA games because they're in a conference (the NWSC, with no other 7AA teams than themselves) that fills up their schedule and doesn't leave many non-conference games available. They scheduled as many 7AA teams as they could.

That is total BS.

I would hate to see Rapids at #4 seeing as how they are not the 4th best team in this section. That would set up a finals match-up in the semi's. Granted in order to go to state you have to beat the best at some point, it just wouldn't be the same to me if DE and GR get to that point, to meet in the semi's and not the finals. The section meeting are usually pretty interesting and there is a lot of hockey to be played before then. Section 7AA is turning out to be quite interesting down the home stretch.

Agreed. Totally sucks if a Rapids/East section final is messed up. Rapids needs to run the table to grab that #2 seed.

dueling21 wrote: They don't play many 7AA games because they're in a conference (the NWSC, with no other 7AA teams than themselves) that fills up their schedule and doesn't leave many non-conference games available. They scheduled as many 7AA teams as they could.

What conference is East in that prohibits them from scheduling Elk River?
Elk River plays EP twice this year.

Grand Rapids doesn't play all the teams in their conference and if you're going to suggest Andover doesn't have a non-conference game they could replace with Rapids, that's just...silly.

At the end of the day, it's both team's "fault" they don't play. Plain and simple. You use the match ups you have to determine seeding. If you want to be seeded higher than someone not leave it up to chance, play them and beat them...

You people have no clue. Andover plays 20 conference games. That leaves room for 5 non conference games. They played Duluth East and were forced by the MSHSL to play EP in a cross conference game. So, now we are donw to three games left. They choose to play in a holiday tourney up north, which gave them a chance to play Cloquet.

I think elk river has a lot of work left to get the two or three seed. I dont see many quality wins on their schedule besides Rapids. So, Rapids people dont complain if your team lost to Elk River. Right now that would put you behind them in section seedings. And Andover has a win against the Elks.

I think if andover beats the elks the next time around it will give andover the 2 seed. If the Elks beat them than I think Andover gets the 4 seed. The 2/3 seed would be a coin toss between Rapids and the Elks. Rapids still has WBL, Moorhead, and Bemidji to show some decent wins. The Elks need to beat someone good to get some respect in the section. My prediction...

1. East
2. Rapids
3. Elks
4. Andover

Tigers33 wrote:You people have no clue. Andover plays 20 conference games. That leaves room for 5 non conference games. They played Duluth East and were forced by the MSHSL to play EP in a cross conference game. So, now we are donw to three games left. They choose to play in a holiday tourney up north, which gave them a chance to play Cloquet.

I think elk river has a lot of work left to get the two or three seed. I dont see many quality wins on their schedule besides Rapids. So, Rapids people dont complain if your team lost to Elk River. Right now that would put you behind them in section seedings. And Andover has a win against the Elks.

I think if andover beats the elks the next time around it will give andover the 2 seed. If the Elks beat them than I think Andover gets the 4 seed. The 2/3 seed would be a coin toss between Rapids and the Elks. Rapids still has WBL, Moorhead, and Bemidji to show some decent wins. The Elks need to beat someone good to get some respect in the section. My prediction...

1. East
2. Rapids
3. Elks
4. Andover

You say we have no clue then go on to say Andover chose to be in a tournament to have a chance to play Cloquet.

For starters, if they really wanted to play Cloquet, the bracket probably could've had them meeting in the first round. That being said, if that was the sole reason for entry in the tournament (it probably wasn't) they probably could've not been in the tournament and schedule both Cloquet and Rapids and maybe Flake or another team with the third opening.

Either way, the point is the same, it's both teams' "faults" that the game doesn't happen.

But yes, I agree with you; if ER wins the second meeting, Rapids should probably be #2.

who has gr beat that is so good

Tigers33 wrote:They played Duluth East and were forced by the MSHSL to play EP in a cross conference game.

Why did the MSHSL force them to play EP?

Northwest suburban was a cross conference game scheduled by the MSHSL. So if you look ever NWS conference team played a game against the lake/classic clake/whatever it is. This is a two year cycle. So, next season all those games will be at the opposite team's arena. I am going to guess thats why ER played EP twice.

Minnetonka, Edina, Wayzata, EP, and Hopkins are in a conference together, and apparently the MSHSL assisted them filling their schedules in various sports.

Tigers33 wrote:You people have no clue. Andover plays 20 conference games. That leaves room for 5 non conference games. They played Duluth East and were forced by the MSHSL to play EP in a cross conference game. So, now we are donw to three games left. They choose to play in a holiday tourney up north, which gave them a chance to play Cloquet.

I think elk river has a lot of work left to get the two or three seed. I dont see many quality wins on their schedule besides Rapids. So, Rapids people dont complain if your team lost to Elk River. Right now that would put you behind them in section seedings. And Andover has a win against the Elks.

I think if andover beats the elks the next time around it will give andover the 2 seed. If the Elks beat them than I think Andover gets the 4 seed. The 2/3 seed would be a coin toss between Rapids and the Elks. Rapids still has WBL, Moorhead, and Bemidji to show some decent wins. The Elks need to beat someone good to get some respect in the section. My prediction...

1. East
2. Rapids
3. Elks
4. Andover

playing 20 conference games doesn't get you any closer to the state tournament than playing 5, 6, 8, or 10. Do you really need to play a home and home with every team in your conference? Why not have it mandatory to play every team in your section once and schedule more non conference games is what I'm wondering???

Teams are in a conference based on size and geographical locations. Conference games take precedent over nonconf games. Some conferences have many more members, which mean more conf games. Most coaches try to schedule as many section games as they can, along with a tournament and trdational rivalries. When there isn't a lot of regular season sectional games, seeding becomes more difficult, and if teams have simalar records and simlar strength schedules, head to head games carry the most weight.

northwoods oldtimer wrote:

dueling21 wrote:

HShockeywatcher wrote: Why is it the responsibility of Andover and Elk River to play those games? It takes two teams to play a game. Regardless of why the game isn't played, it isn't, so you use the games that did happen to evaluate the teams.

I agree, they should play all.

They don't play many 7AA games because they're in a conference (the NWSC, with no other 7AA teams than themselves) that fills up their schedule and doesn't leave many non-conference games available. They scheduled as many 7AA teams as they could.

That is total BS.

Just because you don't like it doesn't mean it isn't true.