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coachdevelopment wrote:Bottom line is she wasn't on the roster per the RULES so a forfeit was right,

BS it is a 10 year old summer tournament, what weenie would have even brought this up? Let the kids play hockey, seems like some parents are way to wrapped up in who wins these summer tournaments. If the kids are getting competitive games (not 10 to 0) then people should be happy.

Are we raising hockey players or attorneys. Hey you lost but we found a loop hole so your still undefeated, yea team.

How would an opposing coach even know this information?
Not only go out of his way to get the roster of the opposing team, but then to know their practice players - and apparently how they skate to identify them as on the ice but not on the roster.
That is some serious preparation for a 10U game.

I think it may have something to do with the unrostered player scoring the tying goal while wearing the jersey of a player who had played for the opposing coach a year or two earlier. Not that surprising that it was found out

I just keep coming back to the fact that this is U10 we're getting all worked up about. Facts are half these girls will likely be done before 14's are over, another half during high school, and maybe one (if that) will play beyond HS.

I know it seems real important now, but the older your girls get, the more you just shake your head.

But I realize that it IS important to you now, and I don't want to belittle that. People shouldn't cheat, I get it.

I don't think anyone is under the illusion that any of these girls are going to play pro hockey or even college hockey for that matter, but that's not the point. Why is following simple rules complicated? Age eligibility, official rosters, are you kidding? These are the most basic fundamental rules we play by. It just seems odd to me that the reaction to people not following rules is that it really isn't that important, or its just "girls' hockey. I don't get it. I would like to tell my daughter that she plays a sport that is legitimate enough to have rules and people should have the integrity to follow them. Simple stuff you would think.

Birthdays I understand.

Playing an age eligible player shouldn't be a big deal. Roster submission? Any organization should just enter all the names of every girl who might play. If you're age eligible you're eligible.

Summer hockey used to use the same July 1 cutoff but it was suggested, and followed, that players play summer hockey at the level they'll play at in the fall.

it was suggested, and followed, that players play summer hockey at the level they'll play at in the fall.

Enough already! Observer is a pretty smart cat, and he doesn't quite get it either, so I'm not sure why a couple ladies, apparently from Andover and, without caring to spend any time looking into it, apparently in the Machine program, have their panties in a knot.

This is all about the trophy, and the way this thread, and a couple others, have been used to assassinate the character of 10 year old girls as cheaters, to bully a young woman into giving up on a group of kids, and to threaten programs that run summer tournaments is shameful. Yes, this IS girls' hockey, and the way it has currently been run, it has opened all sorts of opportunities for hundreds of girls. But I say you should continue your selfish rants that throw gas on the fire to burn it down, until they put a trophy in your case with your daughter's picture on it.

InigoMontoya wrote:

it was suggested, and followed, that players play summer hockey at the level they'll play at in the fall.

Enough already! Observer is a pretty smart cat, and he doesn't quite get it either, so I'm not sure why a couple ladies, apparently from Andover and, without caring to spend any time looking into it, apparently in the Machine program, have their panties in a knot.

This is all about the trophy, and the way this thread, and a couple others, have been used to assassinate the character of 10 year old girls as cheaters, to bully a young woman into giving up on a group of kids, and to threaten programs that run summer tournaments is shameful. Yes, this IS girls' hockey, and the way it has currently been run, it has opened all sorts of opportunities for hundreds of girls. But I say you should continue your selfish rants that throw gas on the fire to burn it down, until they put a trophy in your case with your daughter's picture on it.

Wow! You're quite a detective! Andover Huskies? How did you figure that out? Obviously I was not trying to hide my identity, but nice work on your part anyway.

You wonder why people are upset about this and all I can answer to that is that you either can't read (this thread) or you're not smart enough to understand how pathetic it is to cheat at 10 year old girls hockey. You're right, this is all about the trophy, the Chill cheating to get one. You say that I am assassinating the character of 10 year old girls, again not sure your reading comprehension is up to snuff. I clearly said that it was ADULTS putting these girls in bad positions. There is no question that these girls would not want to knowingly cheat.

Have you talked to the coach that left? I have. I'm not the one she's mad at, I guarantee she did not feel bullied by me. You accuse me of bullying a tournament, that's a good one. The Chill are the ones who talked them into changing their eligibility to begin with! Do your research, talk to the people involved, you may get an education instead of coming on here throwing around a bunch of accusations.

One thing you're right about is that there are hundreds of opportunities for girls to play summer hockey and that's a good thing. I don't see how trying bring integrity and legitimacy to the sport hurts that.

I'm not sure if you have a girl in the program, if you support cheating to win, or if you're sleeping with the guys running it, but whatever your motivation is, I would say you're on the wrong side of the issue.

If you think there are just a couple of people that feel the way I do you're crazy. I have been contacted by people from all over the state who support that this has been brought into the light.

Let me make sure I understand. A 10U team that eventually wins the tournament files a complaint against a 10U team that finishes dead last in the tournament because a girl that Jim previously cut from the team finds an opportunity as a practice player on another team, gets a chance to play in a game, and scores a tying goal in a pool play game? A pool play game? I assume the coach recognized the girl prior to the goal and chose not to say anything until after the result was a tie, then, instead of finding a coaching opportunity to help his team recognize the importance of preparation and focus needed to beat the teams you’re supposed to beat, he chose to throw a hissy fit? After a pool play game? This is what passes for integrity? I'll be on the wrong side of that every day and twice on Sunday.

I'm not with the Machine and I can't speak for them, but I would say the Edge should have had her rostered if there was any chance she was going to play in the tournament. That team's success or failure in the tournament is not relevant to the rules. So a bad team gets to cheat and a good team can't question it?

I've heard different versions of how/why she wasn't rostered. If it was a mistake why not talk to the tourney director prior to putting her on the ice? I would never risk putting my team in a bad spot by playing an unrostered player.

Having said that I do think it's on an entirely different level from what the Chill has been doing but I still say just follow the rules!

BTW, your practice player who may be called upon to play in a tourney doesn't have her own jersey?

Some have said/posted "there just 10 year old girls". Well, yes. But then they're 11 and 12 and then 13, etc, etc. At what age do the offically posted rules begin to mean something?

couldn't agree more Deep Breath. I've said it earlier in this thread, where does it stop and start and who gets to decide? No excuse.

To follow up on an accusation made by montoya; how is what I'm doing selfish? In what way? I wish i knew how all of this was serving me. I considered it the opposite. It's a risk to stick your head up and confront an organization like this because you know there will be rocks getting thrown back at you. Who needs the aggravation? I don't need it and it irritates me that i have to defend my motivation to people who seem to be more accepting of of an organization who has been cheating on a level that is mind boggling for the past few years than the guy who thinks its not right.

I have NOTHING to gain from this other than to hopefully see a program gets it act together and start playing by the same rules the rest of us are.

In related news, a 10U coach drove 56 mph yesterday.

Deep Breath wrote:Some have said/posted "there just 10 year old girls". Well, yes. But then they're 11 and 12 and then 13, etc, etc. At what age do the offically posted rules begin to mean something?

The only thing that should matter in this summer hockey is that you have competitive games with players of relatively the same skill level on the ice together. Go to an Os league game and you will see girls switching teams to make the benches equal, go to a prospects weekend and see a the teams pulled out of a hat, these are the best players in the state u-15 to u18. You will see more and more of the top players and teams skipping these summer tourneys as they get older. Fact is your better off getting a few hours of ice and a ref for $200 to play another equal team then you are spending $1200 for 4 blowouts at the super rink any day. Whitecaps and Ice Cats figured that out 5 years ago. Getting good competitive fun games matters, winning summer tournaments does not.

You want rules and bureaucratic crud there is plenty to go around when the snow flys, you want to give a hard time to the chill fine do it because the have actually paid for banners for summer tourney wins and hung them in an arena (its like a 3rd liner wearing 99, you just dont do it). Could you imagine Breamar if Edina had hung a banner for every tourney win.

D6 - I acknowledge that this isn't life changing stuff but if you're bored with it I'm sure there are other threads that are missing your riveting commentary.

Royals - I'm not debating what constitutes good summer development. I love 3 on 3 leagues, rink rat hockey, etc. and believe those are all great ways to develop and have fun playing the game. When my kid shows up for "just for fun" 3 on 3 tourney or participates in competitive play as part of an OS camp or whatever, that's the expectation. When you sign up for a tournament with rules my expectation is that all teams are playing by the same set. I don't think that is an unreasonable perspective.

This program continues to say that they are not a "tournament" based program and that winning is not important and yet the banners are hanging and the over age players are playing. Its insane to me that this is going on and I think it should be brought out into the open.

Bored with it? Hardly. The level of outrage and self-righteousness is fascinating.

D6 Girls Fan wrote:Bored with it? Hardly. The level of outrage and self-righteousness is fascinating.

INORITE? Time to take a step back and quit mashing F5 for the latest post.

D6 you're probably right, too much outrage and self righteousness.

I'm done now.