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Posted: Tue Feb 08, 2011 6:39 pm
by warriors41
BodyShots wrote:wingmaster wrote:Maybe the recruits should go play juniors for a year or 2. Just a thought.
Not sure that is the answer. I think we all can agree that Don is recruiting very good players. His recruited classes are always ranked among the top in the nation. The problem is that he is not developing the players. They are not getting better with experience.
Examples:
Jay Horrible (sp) was great as a freshman. Fast, electric, aggressive. Now he is average at best, and appears to be loafing whenever the puck is not on his stick.
Jordan Schroeder was an excellent player for the U.S. Development team. As a freshman, he looked very calm, cool, and collected. I even think he was voted freshman of the year in the WCHA. In his second year, he looked disinterested and lethargic. Every time he had the puck and entered the offensive zone, the coasters came on and nothing happened.
David Fisher was Mr Hockey in Minnesota. Did he continue to go down hill from his high school days?
Cade Fairchild was another highly recuited offensive defensemen that came from the U.S. Development team. His offensive abilities have left him, and he is a liability in the defensive zone.
I could go on and on, but that is enough for now. My frustrations are boiling over as it is.
So in a nut shell. If you are getting good recruits every year, but your team is average at best for four straight years. Then your coaching abilities have declined and its time for some new blood to take over!
Just getting the best recruits is not enough. More often than not you can take the best 18 year old kid and he will still get man handled by a mature 21 year old or so. The obvious problem is that the best recruits will probably be offended if the Don says you have to play a year or two of juniors first. However, getting the best kids right out of high school hasn't worked for the Gophers over the last three years. Maybe it's time for Lucia (or whoever gets his job) to try a new strategy and recruit some older kids because it seems to be working for other teams.
Or at least find some balance. It's nice for the Gophs to say that they get all the best high school kids but the result is that you are turning over too much of your roster every two maybe three years. Maybe they could go 50-50 or something. Still get some of the best kids but recruit some of the top end USHL talent that hasn't committed yet. Ryan Walters this year has 16 points so far this year for UNO which would be in the top 4 for Minnesota but the Don didn't want him anymore.
Posted: Tue Feb 08, 2011 7:21 pm
by Mailman
Might be a good idea (or not), but one thing to remember about a kid playing juniors.
It costs. A LOT. And with their schedule, the kid isn't paying for it, so guess who most likely is ?
Lucia et al need to go. Now. Not hard to see that. THAT is where the problem lies, more than anything else.
But with another kid going to enter D1 hockey, he may be hoping he goes to UM, etc.
Posted: Tue Feb 08, 2011 7:44 pm
by PuckU126
Mailman wrote:Might be a good idea (or not), but one thing to remember about a kid playing juniors.
It costs. A LOT. And with their schedule, the kid isn't paying for it, so guess who most likely is ?
Lucia et al need to go. Now. Not hard to see that. THAT is where the problem lies, more than anything else.
But with another kid going to enter D1 hockey, he may be hoping he goes to UM, etc.
Not as much as you think... Players gear, ice time, and travel costs are covered by the team (sponsors). The team usually sets the players up with living quarters and board as well. And jobs are offered by the team as well for side cash.
Not all junior teams are like this, BUT the caliber of players that are D1 bound are on junior teams like I described. USHL for instance.
Posted: Tue Feb 08, 2011 8:34 pm
by Mailman
PuckU126 wrote:Mailman wrote:Might be a good idea (or not), but one thing to remember about a kid playing juniors.
It costs. A LOT. And with their schedule, the kid isn't paying for it, so guess who most likely is ?
Lucia et al need to go. Now. Not hard to see that. THAT is where the problem lies, more than anything else.
But with another kid going to enter D1 hockey, he may be hoping he goes to UM, etc.
Not as much as you think... Players gear, ice time, and travel costs are covered by the team (sponsors). The team usually sets the players up with living quarters and board as well. And jobs are offered by the team as well for side cash.
Not all junior teams are like this, BUT the caliber of players that are D1 bound are on junior teams like I described. USHL for instance.
Most kids have to pay for their billet; the team sets it up, but they don't pay for it. I.e, for the Force, approx. 300/month.
There is also very little time for a kid to work anywhere in most cases.
Posted: Tue Feb 08, 2011 9:15 pm
by PuckU126
Mailman wrote:PuckU126 wrote:Mailman wrote:Might be a good idea (or not), but one thing to remember about a kid playing juniors.
It costs. A LOT. And with their schedule, the kid isn't paying for it, so guess who most likely is ?
Lucia et al need to go. Now. Not hard to see that. THAT is where the problem lies, more than anything else.
But with another kid going to enter D1 hockey, he may be hoping he goes to UM, etc.
Not as much as you think... Players gear, ice time, and travel costs are covered by the team (sponsors). The team usually sets the players up with living quarters and board as well. And jobs are offered by the team as well for side cash.
Not all junior teams are like this, BUT the caliber of players that are D1 bound are on junior teams like I described. USHL for instance.
Most kids have to pay for their billet; the team sets it up, but they don't pay for it. I.e, for the Force, approx. 300/month.
There is also very little time for a kid to work anywhere in most cases.
Your right; most organizations are different. But IMO 300 isn't that bad...
Posted: Tue Feb 08, 2011 10:48 pm
by wingmaster
most teams either made you go to school or have a part time job when i played. Just looked at my pay stubs the other day and i was making a whopping $56.25 a week. It was all worth it!
Posted: Tue Feb 08, 2011 10:55 pm
by PuckU126
wingmaster wrote:most teams either made you go to school or have a part time job when i played. Just looked at my pay stubs the other day and i was making a whopping $56.25 a week. It was all worth it!
Dolla, dolla bills ya'll.
Posted: Wed Feb 09, 2011 7:01 am
by Blue&Gold
PuckU126 wrote:Mailman wrote:PuckU126 wrote:
Not as much as you think... Players gear, ice time, and travel costs are covered by the team (sponsors). The team usually sets the players up with living quarters and board as well. And jobs are offered by the team as well for side cash.
Not all junior teams are like this, BUT the caliber of players that are D1 bound are on junior teams like I described. USHL for instance.
Most kids have to pay for their billet; the team sets it up, but they don't pay for it. I.e, for the Force, approx. 300/month.
There is also very little time for a kid to work anywhere in most cases.
Your right; most organizations are different. But IMO 300 isn't that bad...
For the most part, kids who will play for the Gophers are USHL bound, and the kids pay $0 for that honor. ALL costs are covered by the team, but in the NAHL I believe the players pay the billett, and of course as you move down the ladder, the costs go up BIG TIME. But no, the costs to the player or family is zero, or close to it. Mostly, it's ego that has the kids not wanting to play juniors, because they plan to play college hockey for two years and then sign the big contract. Just like David Fisher...
Posted: Wed Feb 09, 2011 8:55 am
by PuckU126
Blue&Gold wrote:PuckU126 wrote:Mailman wrote:
Most kids have to pay for their billet; the team sets it up, but they don't pay for it. I.e, for the Force, approx. 300/month.
There is also very little time for a kid to work anywhere in most cases.
Your right; most organizations are different. But IMO 300 isn't that bad...
For the most part, kids who will play for the Gophers are USHL bound, and the kids pay $0 for that honor. ALL costs are covered by the team, but in the NAHL I believe the players pay the billett, and of course as you move down the ladder, the costs go up BIG TIME. But no, the costs to the player or family is zero, or close to it. Mostly, it's ego that has the kids not wanting to play juniors, because they plan to play college hockey for two years and then sign the big contract.
Just like David Fisher...
Perfect example. IMO he peaked in HS, but I think we can all agree on that statement. Yes he was given the Mr. Hockey award, but he was not ready for the speed and physical aspects of the NCAA at his age. What he should have done is play 1-2 years of Juniors for prepping and grooming. The U needs to crack down and explain these things to their recruits. Yes you may loose a few but you have to take that chance at times. Grow a pair!
Posted: Wed Feb 09, 2011 9:39 am
by mulefarm
Each player is different and the nhl teams want their draft choice to either play major junior or college, not USHL. At the U it comes down to coaching. Matt McDouagh,Jake Gardiner, Brock Nelson, Archie Skalbeck have adjusted to the WCHA coming directly from HS. Most players could use the USHL, but it is not the only answer.
Posted: Wed Feb 09, 2011 11:13 am
by PuckU126
mulefarm wrote:Each player is different and the nhl teams want their draft choice to either play major junior or college, not USHL. At the U it comes down to coaching. Matt McDouagh,Jake Gardiner, Brock Nelson, Archie Skalbeck have adjusted to the WCHA coming directly from HS. Most players could use the USHL, but it is not the only answer.
Agreed, their are multiple pieces to the Gophers losing puzzle.
Posted: Thu Feb 10, 2011 12:34 pm
by PuckU126
Gophers need points this weekend... Denver is tough, but MN is at home.
Re: Put a fork in the Gophers, they're done....
Posted: Fri Feb 11, 2011 11:17 pm
by PuckU126
Put a fork in the Gophers. they're done....
Again...
Posted: Sat Feb 12, 2011 7:32 am
by gorilla1
3 years running of no NCAAs-can't make this year even if they win out the regular season. Maybe now they'll start recruiting outside of minnesotas borders? Gone are the days where you're going to consistently win with all Minnesota kids- too many other teams come in and get the majority of top kids. Minnesota gets it's share as well, but then they fill in with the rest of the Minnesota kids.
Posted: Sat Feb 12, 2011 8:54 am
by ACTUALFORMERPLAYER
gorilla1 wrote:3 years running of no NCAAs-can't make this year even if they win out the regular season. Maybe now they'll start recruiting outside of minnesotas borders? Gone are the days where you're going to consistently win with all Minnesota kids- too many other teams come in and get the majority of top kids. Minnesota gets it's share as well, but then they fill in with the rest of the Minnesota kids.
wrong, wrong, wrong....As a UND fan and Gopher hater just like you I love watching them fail. I am 100% convinced the Gophers are not losing because of who they recruit or where they are from. There is not one kid on the Gophers roster that every other WCHA coach wouldn't want. They are losing only because Don Lucia and John Hill suck. With that being said, I think it time to extend the Don's contract.
Posted: Sat Feb 12, 2011 11:04 am
by mulefarm
ACTUALFORMERPLAYER wrote:gorilla1 wrote:3 years running of no NCAAs-can't make this year even if they win out the regular season. Maybe now they'll start recruiting outside of minnesotas borders? Gone are the days where you're going to consistently win with all Minnesota kids- too many other teams come in and get the majority of top kids. Minnesota gets it's share as well, but then they fill in with the rest of the Minnesota kids.
wrong, wrong, wrong....As a UND fan and Gopher hater just like you I love watching them fail. I am 100% convinced the Gophers are not losing because of who they recruit or where they are from. There is not one kid on the Gophers roster that every other WCHA coach wouldn't want. They are losing only because Don Lucia and John Hill suck. With that being said, I think it time to extend the Don's contract.
Totally agree!!!
Posted: Sat Feb 12, 2011 11:19 am
by gorilla1
Actual--love the Idea of extendiNg the contract. But I think it should it should be a life time extension for both of them.
As to the reasons, can't argue with you on the coaching. However I disagree on the players. While I think all of the players would end up on a D1 team, many of them would not end up on a big time program.
Posted: Sat Feb 12, 2011 1:03 pm
by PuckU126
ACTUALFORMERPLAYER wrote:gorilla1 wrote:3 years running of no NCAAs-can't make this year even if they win out the regular season. Maybe now they'll start recruiting outside of minnesotas borders? Gone are the days where you're going to consistently win with all Minnesota kids- too many other teams come in and get the majority of top kids. Minnesota gets it's share as well, but then they fill in with the rest of the Minnesota kids.
wrong, wrong, wrong....As a UND fan and Gopher hater just like you I love watching them fail. I am 100% convinced the Gophers are not losing because of who they recruit or where they are from. There is not one kid on the Gophers roster that every other WCHA coach wouldn't want. They are losing only because Don Lucia and John Hill suck. With that being said, I think it time to extend the Don's contract.
Mutual feeling here!
Posted: Sat Feb 12, 2011 5:56 pm
by mulefarm
Pull the fork out!! NCAA here we come!!
Posted: Sat Feb 12, 2011 6:03 pm
by PuckU126
mulefarm wrote:Pull the fork out!! NCAA here we come!!
They scored 3 goals in one period...
They still have to win A LOT more games, mule!
Posted: Sat Feb 12, 2011 6:05 pm
by mulefarm
Do they have running time with a 6 goal lead in college?
Posted: Sat Feb 12, 2011 6:13 pm
by PuckU126
mulefarm wrote:Do they have running time with a 6 goal lead in college?
No.
Posted: Sat Feb 12, 2011 8:30 pm
by mulefarm
After tonight's game I think we will get home ice advantage, win the final five and be in St Paul for the Frozen Four. Dismantling Denver should help us SWEEP the Badgers next week . Do you think we will be in the top 10 of the pairwise after this win? Cade Fairchild looked like the best D in the league. Will he make the 1st team All-WCHA team?
Posted: Sat Feb 12, 2011 8:36 pm
by PuckU126
Posted: Sat Feb 12, 2011 8:38 pm
by mulefarm