Section 4AA 2007-8

Stillh2ofan · Post by **Stillh2ofan** » Tue Mar 13, 2007 8:20 am

First of all this thread is for 4AA predictions and rankings not for E P fans
to cry on so Gopher 9 get a life and start your own thread.

keepitreal · Post by **keepitreal** » Tue Mar 13, 2007 9:17 am

Melvin44 wrote:Stillwater won the State Tournament period! Let them enjoy it!

There were a lot of great teams in Minnesota this year and yes anyone can beat anyone on a given night. Look at the regular season and sections!

Just appreciate great girls hockey and the fact that there were many awesome games this year. Don't dwell so much on who is the best but how far girls hockey has come. Just a few years ago it was who ever had the best player in the state won. Now it's who has the best team players/desire and who wants it the most and of course a little luck!

Stillwater is the team everyone will remember and EP is the team everyone remembers from last year.

Sorry if to many !!!! I'm not very good at this chat thing!

Great post! You are spot on.

Agree, it's great to see how competitive girls hockey has become. Although a "dynasty"-type team can be appreciated for their skill, I MUCH prefer the competition of many good teams in both sections and state, and anyone who understands the true nature and value of sport will agree, no matter how tough the road is to get there as in 4AA and a couple of others. That is also how the interest in the sport will grow, not by dynasty teams. It was a great year for girls (and boys) high school hockey!

Bensonmum · Post by **Bensonmum** » Tue Mar 13, 2007 9:30 am

OK, I was being a smart___ there. I don't even see any reason to have a ranking after the state tournament is over. Leave that to college football. What irks me is when someone says that certain teams who lost and were eliminated in the sections are 'clearly', meaning obviously, better than those who won all their section games and made it to the state tournament. No. It isn't 'clear' to Stillwater fans that EP is better than the Ponies. No way. EP didn't take care of business when it mattered and Stillwater did. That is one gauge (I understand not the only one) of a quality team. Personally I never bothered to look at the post-tourney ranking at all--the only place I heard about it was on the forum. What is possibly the point of it?

MNHockeyFan · Post by **MNHockeyFan** » Tue Mar 13, 2007 10:00 am

Bensonmum wrote:Personally I never bothered to look at the post-tourney ranking at all--the only place I heard about it was on the forum. What is possibly the point of it?

To get everyone here arguing about it?

Seriously, I don't think anyone is questioning the fact that Stillwater deserves to be ranked No. 1 in the final poll. They earned it by winning the State Championship. It's the ranking of the rest of the teams that people can legitimately question - to what degree should the results of the Tourney, the Sections, and the whole season count in ranking the teams after all of the games have been played? I think LPH did a pretty credible job myself.

hockeywild7 · Post by **hockeywild7** » Tue Mar 13, 2007 10:17 am

I can't understand why everyone gets all hung up on ratings anyway. The only true ranking that matters is the one that awards trophies and that would be the state tournament. All rankings are is speculation, this game is played by girls not computers and wannabe coaches. You can debate until the sun dont shine on who you think should of, could of or might be #1 but ultimately thats what the state tournament decides. It is who is playing the best at the end of the season that counts. Stillwater in my opinion had the best defensive team in the state and thats why they won.

finance_gal · Post by **finance_gal** » Tue Mar 13, 2007 10:22 am

I think something that shouldn't be overlooked is that Hill Murray could suddenly become a competitor in this section, they were in every game last year and the school seems to have placed new importance on the program. The new Coach they hired has done more to recruit players, just by being enthusiastic about the program, in the week that he's been coach than I've seen in 4 years. He has impressed both my husband and me and I'm begining to believe that he could bring this team to the promised land and most of all make hockey an enjoyable experiance for everyone.

MNHockeyFan · Post by **MNHockeyFan** » Tue Mar 13, 2007 10:42 am

hockeywild7 wrote:Stillwater in my opinion had the best defensive team in the state and thats why they won.

Just did a quick review of goals against average for some of the better teams throughout the whole season - kind of interesting:

1. Eden Prairie 1.00
2. Holy Angles 1.18
3. Eagan 1.44
4. Hill-Murray 1.59
5. Roseville 1.61
Centennial 1.61
7. Stillwater 1.65
8. BSM 1.68
9. Blaine 1.78
10. Edina 1.81
11. Burnsville 2.10
12. CDH 2.11
13. Wayzata 2.14
14. North Metro 2.20

I may have missed some but these should be most of the best defensive teams...obviously strength of schedule plays a big role here (EP's was fairly weak overall).

titleist · Post by **titleist** » Tue Mar 13, 2007 11:42 am

gopher9 wrote:
Bensonmum wrote:OK gopher, why don't you tell us all who is clearly the best team in the state. And then tell us who is clearly the 2nd best team, etc. Then we clearly don't have to bother with the state tournament.

Then why bother with the regular season then to!!! I guess if you go 26-0 that doesnt mean anything either?Even though Stillwater won the state tournament I dont think clearly they were the best team in the state! Im willing to bet that there were 3-4 teams better than them! But not CLEARLY better than them. So I am not sure who clearly is the best team in the state? You tell me.

Gopher, I'll tell what, I don't think there was a team that could beat Stillwater at the end of the year. I'm not even from Stillwater, and I can say that. Stillwater lost to EP in overtime during the Holiday tournament. I saw that game. They were still emerging into the team that they became. EP is solid, very solid, they have some really good players, but as a team, they never got any better the whole year. I firmly believe that is why they didn't make it to the tourney. If it wasn't Wayzata, it would have been someone else in their section that would have beat them. So with that, I don't know who the other teams that you think are better than Stillwater. The scarier fact is that most all of their guns will be back next year. I saw EP play about 4 times this year and quite honestly was disappointed in how they used their talent. Yes, they won alot of games. Yes they are a very good team, but with the talent they had, they should have. But Stillwater plays as a team, and that is why they have the ability to shut down teams that only play as individuals. Who do you think is better than them? Who are the 3 or 4 teams? Based on what I saw this year and what I saw at the tournament, I think you're mis-guided.

titleist · Post by **titleist** » Tue Mar 13, 2007 11:47 am

finance_gal wrote:I think something that shouldn't be overlooked is that Hill Murray could suddenly become a competitor in this section, they were in every game last year and the school seems to have placed new importance on the program. The new Coach they hired has done more to recruit players, just by being enthusiastic about the program, in the week that he's been coach than I've seen in 4 years. He has impressed both my husband and me and I'm begining to believe that he could bring this team to the promised land and most of all make hockey an enjoyable experiance for everyone.

I love the term "Recruit". I'm sure it was just for scholastic reasons that he's scouting the U-10 and U-12 programs. Ha Ha

finance_gal · Post by **finance_gal** » Tue Mar 13, 2007 12:18 pm

If Hill was going to actively recruit hockey players I don't think they would start with the girls hockey program..that being said, like alot of schools, Hill has a numbers problem when it comes to girls hockey, my daughter is trying to get some of her non Hockey playing friends to go out so that they can fill out the JV next season and I think you will see 10 girls on that JV team that have never played any hockey before. and my hats off to the coach for promoting this because he will have a better and stronger program because of it.

hockeyrube · Post by **hockeyrube** » Tue Mar 13, 2007 12:41 pm

Finance_gal,

Couldn't agree with you more !!!! What the heck was the MSHSL thinking when they created the monster known as Section 4AA ????????? Stillwater will be tough for at least 2 more years, and then they throw in conference rival Roseville (will be tough for a few more years, especially next year), CDH who will be better next year, and HM who will be dramatically better next year and beyond. Not to mention White Bear Lake, who has won the U12A State tournament the past two seasons, and has a strong U14A !!! Don't forget about NSP, who has a great young group and will continue to improve also !!!!! I will bet anyone that by Christmas 2007, this section will have 5 teams in the top 20 in the State !!

Titleist,
Nice comments on Stillwater. The girls deserved to win the State title, they are a hard working bunch, and play as a team. In my mind there were 4 keys to their title run..... (1) Depth and more depth at forward - 3 lines that can fly, and a 4th line that could play with anyone in the State, (2) the senior leadership especially the 2 defense - Bell and Johnson, (3) a great goalie in Plumm, and most importantly (4) a tremendous coaching staff who took a group that lost Jones and Zilles (180 combined points) and tought them how to play great team hockey !!!!!

Rube

finance_gal · Post by **finance_gal** » Tue Mar 13, 2007 1:43 pm

how true!! who ever comes out of the section will be so beat up by the time of the tournament there may not be much left for the big show. Personally I think it's a good thing for girls hockey because the all of the players in a good section will push the quality of play another notch higher. To be competitive schools will be forced to upgrade their programs
and it won't be long before there will be no easy games in girls hockey

gopher9 · Post by **gopher9** » Tue Mar 13, 2007 3:50 pm

Stillh2ofan wrote:First of all this thread is for 4AA predictions and rankings not for E P fans
to cry on so Gopher 9 get a life and start your own thread.

Stillh2ofan · Post by **Stillh2ofan** » Wed Mar 14, 2007 11:01 am

Gopher that's all you got.I was hoping for a _ _ _ _ for brains comeback
also but you must be at a loss for words.

gopher9 · Post by **gopher9** » Wed Mar 14, 2007 2:46 pm

Stillh2ofan wrote:Gopher that's all you got.I was hoping for a _ _ _ _ for brains comeback
also but you must be at a loss for words.

No loss for words here just dont feel like arguing with someone with _ _ _ _ for brains!

hockeywild7 · Post by **hockeywild7** » Wed Mar 14, 2007 10:38 pm

I guess we will never know if, as gopher9 says, there are 3-4 better teams in the state because when it counted none of these 3-4 teams made it to the state tournament to beat Stillwater. Seems to me Stillwater beat everyone they had to in the state tournament and thats all that matters. I wonder where these "other" 3-4 teams are? Who are they and what happend to them? And don't tell me how deep section 6 was as they never even made it to the championship game to challenge Stillwater.

MNHockeyFan · Post by **MNHockeyFan** » Wed Mar 14, 2007 10:48 pm

hockeywild7 wrote:And don't tell me how deep section 6 was as they never even made it to the championship game to challenge Stillwater.

Fortunately for Stillwater they weren't in Section 6. In their three games against Section 6 teams they went 0-2-1.

Stillh2ofan · Post by **Stillh2ofan** » Thu Mar 15, 2007 8:33 am

You section 6 fans just can't get over it. Oh well at least they will be able to see the 1st place trophy on sports wrap tomorrow night.It might give them something to work for.

hockeywild7 · Post by **hockeywild7** » Thu Mar 15, 2007 9:32 am

Very good point MNHockeyFan. As I stated earlier, unless one of those teams keeps winning to get to the state tournament and championship game they dont get a second chance to beat Stillwater. I am not saying they couldnt have beaten them, maybe they would have. But its kind of hard to do if you lose before that opportunity arrises. Stillwater beat everyone they had to when it counted and thats why they are the State Champions for 2007. Should Wayzata be rated higher than EP as they beat them in the sections or maybe Benilde should be rated higher than both of them as they then beat Wayzata? I have no argument that section 6 was the toughest section. With that analogy you would have thought Benilde should have won the state title. They didnt because there is much more parity in girls hockey now and on any given night any team can be beaten. EP was a great team but it wasnt like they were head and shoulders above everyone. Look at their strength of schedule compared to Stillwater. Look at the common opponents between the two. Roseville, Park, Wayzata and Blaine. The scores were pretty much identcal. EP did beat Stillwater head to head, scoring with 8 seconds left in overtime. You cant really make a case that EP was clearly better than Stillwater.

gopher25 · Post by **gopher25** » Thu Mar 15, 2007 9:34 am

I thought this thread was about section 4AA next year. EP, Benidle, Edina and everyone else needs to get over the fact that they did not win a state championship and they were in a tough section.
FYI stillwater also lost to and tied Forrest Lake, I don't see anyone from their team whinning that they didn't make it to state. and lost in sections Hockey is the greatest game because anyone can beat anyone at any time. The state championship was won by Stillwater. Why can't people just relax and give them a thumbs up and be done with it. Stillwater youth prgrams have been in the top 3 in the state for about 6 or 7 years now and haven't ever won the big one, this was finally their time to shine. Give them props and look forward to next year and when your team can try to knock them off.

MNHockeyFan · Post by **MNHockeyFan** » Thu Mar 15, 2007 10:43 am

hockeywild7 and gopher25,

I have absolutely no problem with anything either of you have said above. I've posted before that Stillwater clearly deserves to be ranked No. 1 in the final poll. They came through when it mattered most, and everyone SHOULD congratulate them for winning the State Championship. Nobody can ever take that away from them.

There is no whining, at least from me. All I've done is point out a few facts. I looked back at the last LPH (Feb. 7th) poll taken just before section playoffs started for most teams. In this poll 4 out of the top 6 teams were in Section 6. That makes it pretty tough if you happen to be one of them. No cause for whining, just a real tough road to make it to State.

This coming year it will be different, as a byproduct of realignment is that the best metro teams will be more spread out. Sections 2 and 4 now look to be the toughest, on paper. But I would give you great odds that neither of these new sections will have 4 out of the top 6 ranked teams as we head into the 2008 sections. This past year was in all probability a one-time event.

Again, my sincere congratulations to Stillwater's players and coaches on their great season, and good luck next year.

titleist · Post by **titleist** » Thu Mar 15, 2007 6:11 pm

[quote="finance_gal"]If Hill was going to actively recruit hockey players I don't think they would start with the girls hockey program

You're right, they started with the boys Looooooong ago

titleist · Post by **titleist** » Thu Mar 15, 2007 6:23 pm

MNHockeyFan wrote:
hockeywild7 wrote:And don't tell me how deep section 6 was as they never even made it to the championship game to challenge Stillwater.
Fortunately for Stillwater they weren't in Section 6. In their three games against Section 6 teams they went 0-2-1.

You keep missing the boat, I'll tell you this once again, At the end of the year, State Tournament time, Stillwater would have beat anybody. They were that good at the end of the year. They would have beat any Section 6 team to get to the tournament if they were in that section. It wouldn't have mattered if they lost to someone in the beginning, or middle of the season, because at the end of the season, Stillwater would have beat them. They continually got better and better as the year went on. I won't disagree with the fact that section 6 had very good teams, and that it was a very tough section. With all that in consideration, Stillwater, given a chance to play them all at the end of the year (IMHO) would have beaten all of them. They had everything. 3 solid lines, very solid defense, great special teams, and solid goaltending. EP didn't have solid goaltending; Neither did Roseville or Benilde. Edina didn't have team speed, they had size and strength with above average goaltending. Stillwater had all the elements of a championship team and they proved it.

MNHockeyFan · Post by **MNHockeyFan** » Thu Mar 15, 2007 7:09 pm

titleist wrote:You keep missing the boat, I'll tell you this once again, At the end of the year, State Tournament time, Stillwater would have beat anybody.

You are entitled to your opinion of course but this is pure speculation. If they were so unbeatable late in the year, how did they lose to Cretin Derham Hall at the end of January? And they barely beat both Mounds View and Hastings? All of these teams were unranked and in the three games Stillwater outscored them by a total of one goal - late in the season when you said they were supposed to be unbeatable? And you extend your claim in saying they would have had no trouble beating the No. 1, 2 and 3 teams in the state? Again we will never know as all we can do is speculate, but I don't see the logic here.

notahockeyguy · Post by **notahockeyguy** » Thu Mar 15, 2007 7:58 pm

Stillwater is a great team and won when they had to. That's why they are State Champs. The bigger question is how did BSM lose to North Metro in the semi's. Was that an upset or just overconfidence by players and the coaches.

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Section 4AA 2007-8

Who will win Section 4AA 2007-8?

Ponies on sports wrap.