Minnesota Hockey Taking Over?

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HockeyCrazy1970
Posts: 45
Joined: Sat Nov 24, 2018 1:55 pm

Re: Minnesota Hockey Taking Over?

Post by HockeyCrazy1970 » Thu Sep 03, 2020 10:52 am

Fantastic GoalieDad31 and jg2112!
Nice to see not everyone is hiding in the basement!

Wise Old Man
Posts: 239
Joined: Wed Dec 25, 2019 8:11 pm

Re: Minnesota Hockey Taking Over?

Post by Wise Old Man » Thu Sep 03, 2020 3:12 pm

goaliedad31 wrote:
Thu Sep 03, 2020 6:48 am
Can I just ask, is anyone's kid not playing their full summer schedule? Tournaments are happening everywhere, kids are going to different states to play in the big named tournaments, practices are happening, games are happening, Captains practices are starting.
You're not seeing kids flocking to the hospitals. Cases don't matter. Deaths matter.
SO WHAT IS THE PROBLEM, MSHSL??????
6% of deaths are Covid only, which is why kids are not really affected because kids don't have a lot of underlying health conditions.

Tell the lawyers to take a hike and let the season begin on time and in full.

Sorry to Hunter and Wise Man in advance but just take a breath.

Why it’s so hard to comprehend this I don’t know BUT, IT IS NOT JUST ABOUT DEATHS or, even hospitalizations. New report just today from Pen St.’s Athletcs physician now saying that 30-35% of all BIG10 athletes — not just PSU but, all BIG10 — have contracted myocarditis. Both symptomatic and asymptomatic. I realize you choose to not care about real data and science but, It’s kind of a big deal. And no, my kids haven’t hardly done any skating this summer. And remember, less than 30% of all players play any type of summer check book hockey. There are far less players doing it than not so, I wouldn’t draw any sweeping conclusions about how acceptable parents are to doing it or, that it proves it’s safe just because there are enough parents chasing the DI dream when their kid is 10. 🙄

blueblood
Posts: 2575
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Re: Minnesota Hockey Taking Over?

Post by blueblood » Thu Sep 03, 2020 3:15 pm

WOM;

Touche' on posting before midnight!

One clarification for you: Coaches who attend the MCHA fall clinic advance one level in their USA Hockey CEP certification process. They are not awarded Level 3.

-bb
Play Like a Champion Today

Wise Old Man
Posts: 239
Joined: Wed Dec 25, 2019 8:11 pm

Re: Minnesota Hockey Taking Over?

Post by Wise Old Man » Thu Sep 03, 2020 3:17 pm

blueblood wrote:
Thu Sep 03, 2020 3:15 pm
WOM;

Touche' on posting before midnight!

One clarification for you: Coaches who attend the MCHA fall clinic advance one level in their USA Hockey CEP certification process. They are not awarded Level 3.

-bb
Thanks blueblood. I obviously received inaccurate info. From my district director no less.

blueblood
Posts: 2575
Joined: Fri May 26, 2006 8:36 am

Re: Minnesota Hockey Taking Over?

Post by blueblood » Thu Sep 03, 2020 3:21 pm

WOM:

No worries.

The advancement can progress through Level 4. For Level 5, you must attend the USA Hockey Level 5 Symposium. Was supposed to be held in Duluth this year, but was cancelled.
Play Like a Champion Today

Wise Old Man
Posts: 239
Joined: Wed Dec 25, 2019 8:11 pm

Re: Minnesota Hockey Taking Over?

Post by Wise Old Man » Thu Sep 03, 2020 3:37 pm

blueblood wrote:
Thu Sep 03, 2020 3:21 pm
WOM:

No worries.

The advancement can progress through Level 4. For Level 5, you must attend the USA Hockey Level 5 Symposium. Was supposed to be held in Duluth this year, but was cancelled.
Yeah, I was planning on attending. Is it true you’re part of Goldsworthy’s staff?

Eagles93
Posts: 232
Joined: Sat Jan 03, 2004 5:04 pm

Re: Minnesota Hockey Taking Over?

Post by Eagles93 » Thu Sep 03, 2020 4:02 pm

Wise Old Man wrote:
Thu Sep 03, 2020 3:12 pm

... New report just today from Pen St.’s Athletcs physician now saying that 30-35% of all BIG10 athletes — not just PSU but, all BIG10 — have contracted myocarditis. Both symptomatic and asymptomatic. I realize you choose to not care about real data and science but, It’s kind of a big deal. ...
WOM, you did this with a previous statistic in this post, and you're doing it again. It would help if you would accurately portray statistics. Penn St did not say 30-35% of all athletes have contracted myocarditis. They said 30-35% of all athletes that confirmed positive for COVID-19. That's a huge difference.

I'm not downplaying the study, I agree that if it's true that 30-35% of the positive cases developed myocarditis it is something to be worried about and/or researched further, but please don't fudge the statistics to further your argument.

ClassAGuy
Posts: 200
Joined: Tue Jul 16, 2019 6:51 pm

Re: Minnesota Hockey Taking Over?

Post by ClassAGuy » Thu Sep 03, 2020 4:17 pm

Ok back on Topic

I contacted all of my MSHSL Sources and MSHSL Coaching Sources.

Here is what I got:

Big Dates for the MSHSL:
September 18th they will decide on postseason for Fall Sports... Big to watch to see the trend of if they are going to allow State Tounrey..

OCTOBER 1St

The MSHSL will lay out the Tenative plans for remainign seasons.
- Winter
- Football and Volleyball
- Spring

Once the MSHSL comes out on October 1st and announces how many weeks and games will be cut from ALL winter sports to fit in the Football and Volley ball Season the coaches i talked to said the MN Hockey Coaches Assocaition will propose a bridge season covered by MN Hockey to make up for the loss of weeks and games that will happen.

There will be a season its just gonna be restricted and still no signal on having a postseason with a final state tournament in st paul.

Blueblood let me know if this seems right or if Goldy is telling your staff at Minnetonka any different?

There will be a season just going to be cut the question becomes will MN hockey be allowed to bridge the gap in the meantime?

Wise Old Man
Posts: 239
Joined: Wed Dec 25, 2019 8:11 pm

Re: Minnesota Hockey Taking Over?

Post by Wise Old Man » Thu Sep 03, 2020 5:11 pm

Eagles93 wrote:
Thu Sep 03, 2020 4:02 pm
Wise Old Man wrote:
Thu Sep 03, 2020 3:12 pm

... New report just today from Pen St.’s Athletcs physician now saying that 30-35% of all BIG10 athletes — not just PSU but, all BIG10 — have contracted myocarditis. Both symptomatic and asymptomatic. I realize you choose to not care about real data and science but, It’s kind of a big deal. ...
WOM, you did this with a previous statistic in this post, and you're doing it again. It would help if you would accurately portray statistics. Penn St did not say 30-35% of all athletes have contracted myocarditis. They said 30-35% of all athletes that confirmed positive for COVID-19. That's a huge difference.

I'm not downplaying the study, I agree that if it's true that 30-35% of the positive cases developed myocarditis it is something to be worried about and/or researched further, but please don't fudge the statistics to further your argument.

Eagles...you are correct. Thanks for the correction. I promise, I wasn’t trying to be disingenuous. I meant to state it was all athletes who had contracted Covid. Was rushing my response and didn’t include that phrasing.

blueblood
Posts: 2575
Joined: Fri May 26, 2006 8:36 am

Re: Minnesota Hockey Taking Over?

Post by blueblood » Thu Sep 03, 2020 7:33 pm

New report from several B10 schools seems to contradict PSU findings

https://saturdaytradition.com/big-ten-f ... -athletes/
Play Like a Champion Today

blueblood
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Joined: Fri May 26, 2006 8:36 am

Re: Minnesota Hockey Taking Over?

Post by blueblood » Thu Sep 03, 2020 8:21 pm

Play Like a Champion Today

Wise Old Man
Posts: 239
Joined: Wed Dec 25, 2019 8:11 pm

Re: Minnesota Hockey Taking Over?

Post by Wise Old Man » Thu Sep 03, 2020 10:18 pm

blueblood wrote:
Thu Sep 03, 2020 7:33 pm
New report from several B10 schools seems to contradict PSU findings

https://saturdaytradition.com/big-ten-f ... -athletes/

Certainly interesting. Obviously, I hope that the second report is more accurate than the original as, believe it or not, I actually want a season as much as anyone since it’s how I contribute to the family finances. 😎

grindiangrad-80
Posts: 2486
Joined: Fri Dec 01, 2006 8:00 pm

Re: Minnesota Hockey Taking Over?

Post by grindiangrad-80 » Thu Sep 03, 2020 10:25 pm

Lol.

blueblood
Posts: 2575
Joined: Fri May 26, 2006 8:36 am

Re: Minnesota Hockey Taking Over?

Post by blueblood » Thu Sep 03, 2020 10:28 pm

The volume of information that is changing hourly is mind boggling.
Play Like a Champion Today

grindiangrad-80
Posts: 2486
Joined: Fri Dec 01, 2006 8:00 pm

Re: Minnesota Hockey Taking Over?

Post by grindiangrad-80 » Thu Sep 03, 2020 10:52 pm

The information may change often but the math remains the same.

InThePipes
Posts: 636
Joined: Mon Mar 26, 2012 8:26 pm

Re: Minnesota Hockey Taking Over?

Post by InThePipes » Fri Sep 04, 2020 7:23 am

ClassAGuy wrote:
Thu Sep 03, 2020 4:17 pm
Ok back on Topic

I contacted all of my MSHSL Sources and MSHSL Coaching Sources.

Here is what I got:

Big Dates for the MSHSL:
September 18th they will decide on postseason for Fall Sports... Big to watch to see the trend of if they are going to allow State Tounrey..

OCTOBER 1St

The MSHSL will lay out the Tenative plans for remainign seasons.
- Winter
- Football and Volleyball
- Spring

Once the MSHSL comes out on October 1st and announces how many weeks and games will be cut from ALL winter sports to fit in the Football and Volley ball Season the coaches i talked to said the MN Hockey Coaches Assocaition will propose a bridge season covered by MN Hockey to make up for the loss of weeks and games that will happen.

There will be a season its just gonna be restricted and still no signal on having a postseason with a final state tournament in st paul.

Blueblood let me know if this seems right or if Goldy is telling your staff at Minnetonka any different?

There will be a season just going to be cut the question becomes will MN hockey be allowed to bridge the gap in the meantime?
Serious question...why go to the hassle of creating a "bridge season", why doesn't MSHSL just cancel the HS season immediately and let MN Hockey run with it this year? And I mean a reason other than the MNSHL isn't quite ready to part with several million dollars, the writing is on the wall on that front regardless of what they decide, so just let the kids play and get out of the way.

Rails Hockey
Posts: 29
Joined: Fri Feb 28, 2020 9:51 am

Re: Minnesota Hockey Taking Over?

Post by Rails Hockey » Fri Sep 04, 2020 8:54 am

Wise Old Man wrote:
Thu Sep 03, 2020 10:18 pm
blueblood wrote:
Thu Sep 03, 2020 7:33 pm
New report from several B10 schools seems to contradict PSU findings

https://saturdaytradition.com/big-ten-f ... -athletes/

Certainly interesting. Obviously, I hope that the second report is more accurate than the original as, believe it or not, I actually want a season as much as anyone since it’s how I contribute to the family finances. 😎
You don’t have to hope, read the other article he included. PSU retracted it, it was 100% false. That was the “Real Science and Data” that you said the rest of us couldn’t understand.

Wise Old Man
Posts: 239
Joined: Wed Dec 25, 2019 8:11 pm

Re: Minnesota Hockey Taking Over?

Post by Wise Old Man » Fri Sep 04, 2020 2:00 pm

Rails Hockey wrote:
Fri Sep 04, 2020 8:54 am
Wise Old Man wrote:
Thu Sep 03, 2020 10:18 pm
blueblood wrote:
Thu Sep 03, 2020 7:33 pm
New report from several B10 schools seems to contradict PSU findings

https://saturdaytradition.com/big-ten-f ... -athletes/

Certainly interesting. Obviously, I hope that the second report is more accurate than the original as, believe it or not, I actually want a season as much as anyone since it’s how I contribute to the family finances. 😎
You don’t have to hope, read the other article he included. PSU retracted it, it was 100% false. That was the “Real Science and Data” that you said the rest of us couldn’t understand.


Rails....not sure what you mean when you say it was "100% false". If your interpretation is that the doctor is now saying that there hasn't been any myocarditis in any BIG10 athletes who've tested poaitive for Covid, you may want to go back and re-read the Penn St. doctor's clarification. He is not saying there isn't any myocarditis being found in BIG10 athletes who tested positive for Covid. Here's the important portion of his clarification:

"During his discussion with board members, he recalled initial preliminary data that had been verbally shared by a colleague on a forthcoming study, which unbeknownst to him at the time had been published at a lower rate."

What he's saying is that the 30-35% number is inaccurate. Not, that there haven't been any athletes diagnosed with myocarditis post-Covid infection. It's still an extremely concerning issue. The "colleague" he was referring to is Dr. Curt Daniels, the Director of Sports Cardiology at Ohio St. Here's a portion of a New York Times article about the situation;

"Daniels, the director of sports cardiology at Ohio State, had also been busy, working to publish a three-month study whose preliminary findings were presented to Pac-12 and Big Ten leaders before they shut down football earlier this month. Daniels said that cardiac M.R.I.s, an expensive and sparingly used tool, revealed an alarmingly high rate of myocarditis — heart inflammation that can lead to cardiac arrest with exertion — among college athletes who had recovered from the coronavirus.

The survey found myocarditis in close to 15 percent of athletes who had the virus, almost all of whom experienced mild or no symptoms, Daniels added, perhaps shedding more light on the uncertainties about the short- and long-term effects the virus may have on athletes."

Here's the link to the article itself so you can review it if you'd like;

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/08/23/spor ... virus.html

The point is, the original statement by the Penn St. doctor wasn't "100% false". He simply gave an inflated number which, is what caught everyone's attention because anyone who had been covering the story assumed he was referring to what the Ohio St. doctor's final report might have indicated. And, since the Penn St. doctor's number was double what the Ohio St. doctor had said initially, it only increased the possible seriousness of the issue.

For those of you that may be minimizing this potential post-infection issue, please see this other New York Times article on myocarditis;

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/08/17/opin ... sease.html

Rails Hockey
Posts: 29
Joined: Fri Feb 28, 2020 9:51 am

Re: Minnesota Hockey Taking Over?

Post by Rails Hockey » Fri Sep 04, 2020 2:34 pm

Wise Old Man wrote:
Fri Sep 04, 2020 2:00 pm
Rails Hockey wrote:
Fri Sep 04, 2020 8:54 am
Wise Old Man wrote:
Thu Sep 03, 2020 10:18 pm



Certainly interesting. Obviously, I hope that the second report is more accurate than the original as, believe it or not, I actually want a season as much as anyone since it’s how I contribute to the family finances. 😎
You don’t have to hope, read the other article he included. PSU retracted it, it was 100% false. That was the “Real Science and Data” that you said the rest of us couldn’t understand.


Rails....not sure what you mean when you say it was "100% false". If your interpretation is that the doctor is now saying that there hasn't been any myocarditis in any BIG10 athletes who've tested poaitive for Covid, you may want to go back and re-read the Penn St. doctor's clarification. He is not saying there isn't any myocarditis being found in BIG10 athletes who tested positive for Covid. Here's the important portion of his clarification:

"During his discussion with board members, he recalled initial preliminary data that had been verbally shared by a colleague on a forthcoming study, which unbeknownst to him at the time had been published at a lower rate."

What he's saying is that the 30-35% number is inaccurate. Not, that there haven't been any athletes diagnosed with myocarditis post-Covid infection. It's still an extremely concerning issue. The "colleague" he was referring to is Dr. Curt Daniels, the Director of Sports Cardiology at Ohio St. Here's a portion of a New York Times article about the situation;

"Daniels, the director of sports cardiology at Ohio State, had also been busy, working to publish a three-month study whose preliminary findings were presented to Pac-12 and Big Ten leaders before they shut down football earlier this month. Daniels said that cardiac M.R.I.s, an expensive and sparingly used tool, revealed an alarmingly high rate of myocarditis — heart inflammation that can lead to cardiac arrest with exertion — among college athletes who had recovered from the coronavirus.

The survey found myocarditis in close to 15 percent of athletes who had the virus, almost all of whom experienced mild or no symptoms, Daniels added, perhaps shedding more light on the uncertainties about the short- and long-term effects the virus may have on athletes."

Here's the link to the article itself so you can review it if you'd like;

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/08/23/spor ... virus.html

The point is, the original statement by the Penn St. doctor wasn't "100% false". He simply gave an inflated number which, is what caught everyone's attention because anyone who had been covering the story assumed he was referring to what the Ohio St. doctor's final report might have indicated. And, since the Penn St. doctor's number was double what the Ohio St. doctor had said initially, it only increased the possible seriousness of the issue.

For those of you that may be minimizing this potential post-infection issue, please see this other New York Times article on myocarditis;

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/08/17/opin ... sease.html
This is what caught my eye:

“Of the 26 schools (all Power 5) that answered the question about heart-related conditions for student-athletes, only one school — Oregon State — reported having an athlete who developed heart-related issues after contracting COVID-19, but the school stated it was not myocarditis, an inflammation of the heart muscle.”

So if I’m reading that correctly, those 26 Power 5 schools reported Zero cases of Myocarditis, which is a much larger sample size than the BIG. I guess my point is that this is light years away from 30-35%.

I’m not looking for an argument, but if I was, I think I could absolutely make the case that it was 100% wrong. If I get a question on a Math test asking what is 5x2 and I answer 20, am I 100% wrong? Or did I simply inflate the number?

goldy313
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Re: Minnesota Hockey Taking Over?

Post by goldy313 » Fri Sep 04, 2020 10:51 pm

I think the September 18th date may get pushed back a week. The generally accepted two week lag time puts the 18th less than 2 weeks from Labor Day. Moving it a week later puts it outside the Labor Day weekend. If on September 25 there is no significant uptick (outside college campuses) I think things can move forward.

east hockey
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Re: Minnesota Hockey Taking Over?

Post by east hockey » Sat Sep 05, 2020 12:19 am

We have another topic which has turned into a pissing match with personal attacks included. I'm locking this topic.

Because people can't learn to disagree without being disagreeable, and can't be mindful of the forum rules, there will be no more topics allowed regarding COVID-19. I'm tired of babysitting certain posters. It's not as simple as banning one or two users--far more than that have been involved in this garbage, taking their COVID-19 opinions from topic to topic.

If the Board empties out as a result, so be it. Follow the rules or get out.

Lee
Message Board arsonist since 2005
Egomaniac since 2006

Locked