New Section Assignments

MHGr8ness · Post by **MHGr8ness** » Sat Mar 09, 2013 5:22 pm

HShockeywatcher wrote:
MHGr8ness wrote:
HShockeywatcher wrote: What is the rational for putting co-op teams in AA? Teams don't co-op to form one big "super team." Teams co-op because one or all of the teams can't field a team without co-oping. Putting them in AA makes zero sense to me.
The fact that they are placed in AA is a way to prevent teams from trying the "super team" tactic. The logic is, "it's not worth joining those organizations to get better because we'll have to be bumped up." Some associations don't mind the bump up because it only affects them in the postseason.

Also co-ops aren't usually formed because that's the only way a team can be formed. It's usually a way to get some kids from a school that may not enough players to form a team on their own playing the game. Occasionally the school or schools that get added bump the original school that could have its own team from A to AA, which is unfair to the school that accepts the smaller one. That's how New Ulm has gotten their petitions passed recently.
That's exactly what I said...

Not my top part.

Deck Slide · Post by **Deck Slide** » Sat Mar 09, 2013 5:57 pm

MHGr8ness wrote:
HShockeywatcher wrote:
MHGr8ness wrote: The fact that they are placed in AA is a way to prevent teams from trying the "super team" tactic. The logic is, "it's not worth joining those organizations to get better because we'll have to be bumped up." Some associations don't mind the bump up because it only affects them in the postseason.

Also co-ops aren't usually formed because that's the only way a team can be formed. It's usually a way to get some kids from a school that may not enough players to form a team on their own playing the game. Occasionally the school or schools that get added bump the original school that could have its own team from A to AA, which is unfair to the school that accepts the smaller one. That's how New Ulm has gotten their petitions passed recently.
That's exactly what I said...
Not my top part.

New Ulm/Sleepy Eye got put where they should be. They have two rinks in New Ulm and o. ne in Sleepy Eye. There is a big opportunity there to grow a hockey program.

defense · Post by **defense** » Sat Mar 09, 2013 6:24 pm

3a added Morris Benson and Willmar from 6 a, 6a added Cathedral of St. Cloud and Sauk Rapids.
I guess to me this means SCC and Willmar will be in the state tourney next year.

computerguy · Post by **computerguy** » Sat Mar 09, 2013 10:04 pm

New Ulm will not stay in 2AA. I found out today that they are dropping 2 schools from that coop. Two schools that they got zero players from.

HShockeywatcher · Post by **HShockeywatcher** » Sat Mar 09, 2013 11:33 pm

computerguy wrote:New Ulm will not stay in 2AA. I found out today that they are dropping 2 schools from that coop. Two schools that they got zero players from.

The Hub article on the alignment said that both New Ulm and Minnehaha will petition to play down next year.

wannagototherink · Post by **wannagototherink** » Sun Mar 10, 2013 12:07 am

How many Marshall fans just lost their lunch seeing Hermantown in 7A now?

Logiiii · Post by **Logiiii** » Sun Mar 10, 2013 12:22 am

To all the people hoping for Eagan and co. to save the state from STA, you're going to be disappointed, or at least back maybe Eastview or Cretin.

Unless Gabrielle stays and Lindgren develops into what his brother is, Eagan is about to enter at least a 7 year slump, based on PeeWee and Bantam results.

BP · Post by BP » Sun Mar 10, 2013 4:06 am

HShockeywatcher wrote:
computerguy wrote:New Ulm will not stay in 2AA. I found out today that they are dropping 2 schools from that coop. Two schools that they got zero players from.
The Hub article on the alignment said that both New Ulm and Minnehaha will petition to play down next year.

Both will be A. The State HS League is a joke and has no idea what they are doing. Until the start listening to the MCHA, it will be a mess. Figure it out!!!!!!!!!!!!

WB6162 · Post by **WB6162** » Sun Mar 10, 2013 7:57 am

I didn't realize Farmington was AA. They are never going to see a State Tourney in that section.

almostashappy · Post by **almostashappy** » Sun Mar 10, 2013 12:16 pm

Logiiii wrote:To all the people hoping for Eagan and co. to save the state from STA, you're going to be disappointed, or at least back maybe Eastview or Cretin.

Unless Gabrielle stays and Lindgren develops into what his brother is, Eagan is about to enter at least a 7 year slump, based on PeeWee and Bantam results.

Almost as Happy Off-season, Everyone!

You know, we saw the same kind of naysaying about Eagan's prospects last Spring. It certainly will be refreshing not to have to live up to everyone's lofty expectations next year.

Gabrielle signed with Brandon Wheat Kings, so he's past the point of no return to the MSHSL. And it's true that Eagan's had a tough run at PeeWee/Bantam level last few years. They won't have this year's depth (unless a minivan load of move-ins shows up this Summer or some underclassmen really step up). But what they will have are three probable starters that weren't on the correlative 2010-11 Bantam A squad (Lingren, Jensen and Elsenheimer), and a top d-pair (Muck, Wolff) with a full year of varsity under their belt (unlike any of the d-men this year).

Pre-pre-pre-season 3AA rankings probably puts Eagan third (behind STA and Eastview), and 20 regular season wins for a fifth straight year will be a tall order. But that might not be such a bad thing...Edina certainly didn't suffer from only 19 regular season wins, and a case can be made that playing from behind and/or having a few more close losses would have helped this year's Wildcat team in the Section Final.

Ogie · Post by **Ogie** » Sun Mar 10, 2013 12:39 pm

jonandrews13 wrote:Kennedy is going A? Wow. I know they haven't been competitive, but their enrollment is down too?

Their JV only had two lines and no backup goalie this year.

alcloseshaver · Post by **alcloseshaver** » Sun Mar 10, 2013 12:41 pm

Can you petition down if you receive no players from the coop? Would certain schools cut or not accept players from a coop then?

codyy33 · Post by **codyy33** » Sun Mar 10, 2013 3:08 pm

5A
Chisago Lakes Area High School
North Branch High School
Princeton High School
Proctor High School
Spring Lake Park High School
Moose Lake Area
Mora/Hinckley-Finlayson"
Pine City/Rush City
Providence Academy

DKS1962 · Post by **DKS1962** » Sun Mar 10, 2013 4:49 pm

5A...a chance for Providence Academy to keep recruiting and knock out the legit A communities.

oldschoolpuckster · Post by **oldschoolpuckster** » Sun Mar 10, 2013 5:07 pm

DKS1962 wrote:5A...a chance for Providence Academy to keep recruiting and knock out the legit A communities.

I find it funny (sick) that the private schools get all of the blame here...how much of the blame gets put on the community that can't hold on to these kids? And why is hockey seem to be the only sport that this issue brings this much attention (anger)? What about Football, Soccer, Baseball, Wrestling, etc...???

If all of you "haters" had any kind of a clue.....you would realize that public schools recruit just as much (if not more) than privates. At least the privates can offer an opportunity at a superior education. The state of MN public education system is a joke!!! and everyone knows it to be true.

hawkhockey · Post by **hawkhockey** » Sun Mar 10, 2013 5:23 pm

oldschoolpuckster wrote:
DKS1962 wrote:5A...a chance for Providence Academy to keep recruiting and knock out the legit A communities.
I find it funny (sick) that the private schools get all of the blame here...how much of the blame gets put on the community that can't hold on to these kids? And why is hockey seem to be the only sport that this issue brings this much attention (anger)? What about Football, Soccer, Baseball, Wrestling, etc...???

If all of you "haters" had any kind of a clue.....you would realize that public schools recruit just as much (if not more) than privates. At least the privates can offer an opportunity at a superior education. The state of MN public education system is a joke!!! and everyone knows it to be true.

That superior education thing is a load of crap. There are some private schools that offer better educations but not all. I don't know if you heard the Hill-Murray student section chant "What's a trojan" against Wayzata but that didn't exactly showcase their intelligence. I, and many others, are a product of the Minnesota public school system and are quite successful. So get off your high horse of private education. Just because you believe yourself to be superior because you paid for your education does not mean it's actually true. Get over yourself.

hockeydad · Post by **hockeydad** » Sun Mar 10, 2013 6:27 pm

About 10 years ago the league used a percentage formula to set enrollment numbers so that teams like Le Sueur/St Peter and New Ulm/etc. would have a chance to stay in Class A. They used the formula for all sports. A group of smaller schools in southern Minnesota introduced an amendment that eliminated the formula and made it a total enrollment thing. The amendment passed. If I remember correctly, the move was from a bunch of wrestlign schools that wanted some of the co-op programs in that sport to move up a level. Blue Earth was one of the schools pushing for the amendment.

Ironic part, Blue Earth had a coop with Fairmont for hockey at the time. It pushed Fairmont up to AA. Fairmont responded by dropping Blue Earth from the co-op. I believe they are back together again for hockey, but the numbers aren't what they were back then and they are still in Class A.

DubCHAGuy · Post by **DubCHAGuy** » Sun Mar 10, 2013 7:54 pm

oldschoolpuckster wrote:
DKS1962 wrote:5A...a chance for Providence Academy to keep recruiting and knock out the legit A communities.
I find it funny (sick) that the private schools get all of the blame here...how much of the blame gets put on the community that can't hold on to these kids? And why is hockey seem to be the only sport that this issue brings this much attention (anger)? What about Football, Soccer, Baseball, Wrestling, etc...???

If all of you "haters" had any kind of a clue.....you would realize that public schools recruit just as much (if not more) than privates. At least the privates can offer an opportunity at a superior education. The state of MN public education system is a joke!!! and everyone knows it to be true.

Because hockey is a sport mostly for rich kids (or at least not for struggling families) who are more likely to attend private schools, especially if its just an easy way to get onto a better hockey team.

Mite-dad · Post by **Mite-dad** » Sun Mar 10, 2013 10:03 pm

The changes seem to be fine except for what they did to 7A and 5A. WTH were they thinking?

WBLHockeyfan04 · Post by **WBLHockeyfan04** » Sun Mar 10, 2013 11:46 pm

I was hoping they would've made some changes to 1AA and 6AA, but it apparently wasn't meant to be. 1AA has been awful for as long as I can remember. They never produce a legit team that you actually think could win it all, and 6AA has been producing at least 3-4 good teams for years now.

Moving one of either Tonka, EP, or Wayzata to 2AA and either one of Prior Lake, Burnsville, Jefferson, Eastview, etc to 1AA wouldn't mess things up geographically. They're in the same conferences to begin with!

Ira Bentnee · Post by **Ira Bentnee** » Mon Mar 11, 2013 9:25 am

You gotta wonder what type of hold the private schools have on the high school league. Giving the private schools options to move up to AA or remain A while forcing co-ops to AA based on combined enrollment is not a level playing field. In the states to study the minny model I find it hard rationalize that co-op programs or programs that might have light numbers in a high enrollment public school have the same advantage as a private school program, that have no geographic restrictions in filling their rosters. Some public school co-ops don't even have a local rink and have to buy ice time from a neighboring community rink while some private schools have their own rink on campus. That coach from Hermantown has a valid point. All that is grass roots in the private programs is how many players they can bring in from other in-state community programs and hold the additional advantage from outside state lines. Advantages like that over the public schools should place the private schools in the AA classification with no questions. For the young start up co-op programs or low numbered high enrollment public school programs, they should have the option of A or AA, not the private schools.

jeffpv · Post by **jeffpv** » Mon Mar 11, 2013 11:02 am

oldschoolpuckster wrote:
DKS1962 wrote:
If all of you "haters" had any kind of a clue.....you would realize that public schools recruit just as much (if not more) than privates. At least the privates can offer an opportunity at a superior education. The state of MN public education system is a joke!!! and everyone knows it to be true.
This is sort of tangential to the greater discussion, but the MN public education system is one of the best in the country. If you prefer private schools that's all fine and good, but you needn't lie in order to make your point.

Tenoverpar · Post by **Tenoverpar** » Mon Mar 11, 2013 12:20 pm

With the new sections you can count on this:

1AA: Farmington good young corp may compete otherwise one of the Lakevilles will make the annual trip up 35E

2AA: Edina will represent this class 9 of the next 10 years, there will be 1 lucky one where Burnsville finally gets through

3AA: STA will be a mainstay fixture, CDH draws basically zero top end hockey players and the Cadets bring in a group of several every single year. Eastview and Eagan will always compete but for the next 4 or 5 years at least STA will keep booking section 113 for their students.

4AA: Hill Murray and the field. Any real questions on this section and you're fooling yourself.

5AA: This section will rotate Annually and bring a big student section to the X but will always be a 5 or at large, so they will be a sentimental favorite. Blaine and Centennial being the regulars.

6AA: Obviously someone from Edina is on the selection committee for this thing, considering they could have moved someone, anyone out of 6AA to 2AA to help make that section at least a competition. Instead we'll continue to see the best final 4 in the state every year with this group. BSM-EP, Minnetonka and Wayzata...what a brutal section.

7AA: East will likely be the favorite here year in and year out. Elk river doesn't seem to be able to ever get over the hump despite good teams, Rapids is always good but can they be great, FLAKE has a good system in place and with the buy in of it's players, perhaps they may be the surprise team one year.

8AA: Moorhead seems to have a foothold on this section. Roseau was the favorite cinderalla for years but it seems like they fell off a bit, must be global warming. Is there really anyone that will compete for this section?

just .02 cents

hawkhockey · Post by **hawkhockey** » Wed Mar 13, 2013 11:57 pm

WBLHockeyfan04 wrote:I was hoping they would've made some changes to 1AA and 6AA, but it apparently wasn't meant to be. 1AA has been awful for as long as I can remember. They never produce a legit team that you actually think could win it all, and 6AA has been producing at least 3-4 good teams for years now.

Moving one of either Tonka, EP, or Wayzata to 2AA and either one of Prior Lake, Burnsville, Jefferson, Eastview, etc to 1AA wouldn't mess things up geographically. They're in the same conferences to begin with!

Wow some real groundbreaking material here. 1AA is still doing better than 5AA in recent memory

almostashappy · Post by **almostashappy** » Thu Mar 14, 2013 6:59 am

hawkhockey wrote:
WBLHockeyfan04 wrote:I was hoping they would've made some changes to 1AA and 6AA, but it apparently wasn't meant to be. 1AA has been awful for as long as I can remember. They never produce a legit team that you actually think could win it all, and 6AA has been producing at least 3-4 good teams for years now.

Moving one of either Tonka, EP, or Wayzata to 2AA and either one of Prior Lake, Burnsville, Jefferson, Eastview, etc to 1AA wouldn't mess things up geographically. They're in the same conferences to begin with!
Wow some real groundbreaking material here. ISD194 is still doing better than 5AA in recent memory

Fixed that for you.