AA Rankings for 1/29/12

[karl(east)]

After a relatively tame month of ranking, things have finally blown up in the past two weeks. Last week the top 4 were shaken up, but things reverted to form this week; on the other hand, there was a lot of movement in the 6-10 area, and more than a few teams have very narrow holds on their current spots. Lake Conference play never ceases to disappoint; we’ll see who comes out of the ongoing battles looking most stable.

1. Duluth East (18-1)
-In their only game this past week, the Hounds took out their frustrations over the Minnetonka loss in a rout over a decent Forest Lake team. Minnetonka’s loss allows them to climb back into the top spot, and it will take a large upset for them to lose it for the remainder of the season. The questions raised in the Tonka loss will continue to linger, but it’s hard to argue against their overall record, or to claim that some particularly hot team should be challenging for the top spot. The week ahead includes a decent Wisconsin team and then arguably their toughest game left, though Blaine has struggled lately.
This week: Tues at Superior (WI), Sat vs. #14 Blaine

2. Minnetonka (17-3)
-The past two weeks have been very hit-or-miss for the Skippers; they have dominant wins over Duluth East and Wayzata, but also losses to Edina and Eden Prairie. This sets off some alarm bells; they will have to win five tough games to win a state title, and inconsistency along the way will doom them. But for now, knowing their talent level and strength of schedule, they settle in at #2. A rubber match with Edina in their only game this week will tell us more.
This week: Sat at #5 Edina

3. Maple Grove (17-1-2)
-I’m wavering over what to do with this team; the ‘1’ in the loss column is a pretty good argument to put them at #2, and a second win over Blaine has to be an encouraging sign. Still, that Andover tie lingers, and with some complaints about the way they’ve been playing lately, it makes more sense to keep them at #3. The remaining schedule is not overly challenging; if Tonka stumbles again, they have a great shot at #2.
This week: Thurs vs. Champlin Park, Sat at Centennial

4. Eagan (17-2)
-Took care of business against a bunch of weaker teams. The Wildcats’ schedule makes them hard to judge against the other top teams, but they certainly deserve credit for their steadiness. The Hill-Murray game on Tuesday will be an important measuring stick of this team’s ability, and they also play section rival Apple Valley for the second time.
This week: Tues at #10 Hill-Murray, Thurs vs. Apple Valley, Sat vs. Eastview

5. Edina (16-3)
-A solid win over Wayzata breaks the Hornets’ long losing streak against the Trojans, while Minnetonka’s loss suddenly puts them in the Lake Conference driver’s seat. The week ahead, however, offers us two nights of bedlam at Braemar, with contests against two rivals they’ve managed to beat in their previous meetings this year. Time to learn just how much this young Hornets team has grown up.
This week: Thurs vs. #6 Eden Prairie, Sat vs. #2 Minnetonka

6. Eden Prairie (13-4-1)
-It was a huge week for the Eagles, who responded from a flat loss to Wayzata with a win over a dangerous Lakeville South team and a big upset over Minnetonka. They’ve had their spurts of inconsistency this season, but they seem to be capable of beating anyone on any given night, and if they can build some momentum and manage to take out Edina this week, look out.
This week: Thurs at #5 Edina, Sat at Hopkins

7. Moorhead (16-3)
-It’s hard not to move the Spuds up after a huge week, in which they held off rival Roseau, took down a Benilde team that beat them earlier in the year, and shut out a decent Centennial team. Their lack of wins against the top handful of teams is the only thing holding them back. If they can handle a tough test in Grand Rapids this week, the inevitable Lake Conference carnage should let them climb a little bit further.
This week: Sat at #13 Grand Rapids

8. Wayzata (11-6-1)
-The Trojans had a very poor week, losing 5-1 and 5-2 to Minnetonka and Edina, respectively. But a lack of good candidates for the #8 spot and an overall resume that holds up pretty well keeps them here. They get a rare easy week in the Lake portion of their season, with games against conference bottom-feeder Hopkins and Buffalo.
This week: Thurs vs. Hopkins, Sat vs. Buffalo

9. Benilde-St. Margaret’s (13-5)
-A rough loss to Moorhead is another dent in the Red Knights’ record, and time is running out for things to come together. Their game against Wayzata in two weeks will be huge. Their two opponents this week should both be wins, though Jefferson has some mild upset potential after taking down Burnsville on Saturday.
This week: Tues at Bloomington Jefferson, Sat at Spring Lake Park

10. Hill-Murray (12-5)
-The Pioneers had a strong week, with noticeably stronger wins over St. Thomas Academy and Mahtomedi than they had the first time around. It’s a clear sign of improvement; this week we’ll see if that can translate into a game against a top-end team. There are still some questions about their defense that need to be answered.
This week: Tues vs. #4 Eagan, Thurs at Richfield, Sat vs. Simley

11. Lakeville South (11-7)
-Demolished a pair of low-level SSC teams, flashing their offensive prowess in the process. The Cougars’ schedule gets incrementally tougher over the next few weeks; on paper they have two wins over the next week, but Jefferson is capable of the upset and Prior Lake knocked them off back in early January.
This week: Thurs vs. Bloomington Jefferson, Sat at Prior Lake

12. Andover (12-5-1)
-The Huskies took care of Osseo in their only game this past week, allowing them to stay in this spot in the rankings. They face a crucial section game on Tuesday against Elk River, along with two other winnable games.
This week: Tues at Elk River, Thurs vs. Robbinsdale Armstrong, Sat at Anoka

13. Grand Rapids (15-5)
-Got a second strong win over Bemidji, though the International Falls win was a bit close for comfort. This week’s test against Moorhead will be a big one; a win might give them a shot at the top ten, and since they don’t play Andover, there’s a chance it could also factor into section seeding.
This week: Tues vs. Virginia, Sat vs. #7 Moorhead

14. Blaine (11-7)
-Not a great spot for a team that’s lost three in a row, but the Bengals have enough of an edge over the teams below them that they weren’t passed. Still, they will need to get things together soon. A game against Duluth East is certainly an opportunity to do so, though after the Champlin Park loss they can’t exactly take Osseo for granted, either.
This week: Thurs at Osseo, Sat at #1 Duluth East

15. Elk River (10-7-2)
-A win over Blaine is a step in the right direction, though there was enough distance between them that Blaine’s overall resume is still slightly better. They will need to build some momentum to convince me they belong any higher; they can certainly start to do that if they can bring down Andover on Tuesday.
This week: Tues vs. #12 Andover, Thurs vs. Coon Rapids, Sat at Champlin Park

Bubble

Burnsville (11-8-1)
-Most of the Blaze’s losses in their recent skid have been to pretty good teams; that was not the case with the Jefferson loss, which drives them out of the rankings. They have some potential, but certainly aren’t realizing it right now. Possibly tough games against Prior Lake and Lakeville North this week will tell us which direction they’re heading.

Centennial (9-8-2)
-Not an ideal week for the Cougars, who couldn’t beat Elk River and got shut out by Moorhead. Only one game this week, but it’s a tough one against Maple Grove.

Cloquet (15-6)
-Stumbled in overtime against Duluth Marshall, but movement amongst the SSC teams immediately below them keeps them at #18 for a fourth consecutive week. Huge test coming up on Thursday against Hermantown; the Jacks may be the only team standing between the Hawks and an undefeated regular season.

Prior Lake (12-7)
-Finally achieving some steadiness, and narrow wins over Lakeville North and Apple Valley are a positive step for a team trying to distinguish them in the SSC’s crowded second tier. Games against Burnsville and Lakeville South this week give them further chances to prove what they can do.

Apple Valley (9-7-2)
-Suffered a narrow loss to Prior Lake, though they bounced back with a win over Lakeville North. Eagan is up this week.

Beyond the top 20: Brainerd, Lakeville North, White Bear Lake; the SEC field and 8AA teams such as Bemidji and Roseau.

Sections, with a little more emphasis on lower seeds than normal:

1AA
Lakeville North
11 Lakeville South
-North is still clinging to the top spot by virtue of their win over South; their meeting on February 9 will decide if it stays that way or not. Rochester Mayo is probably in the driver’s seat for the 3-seed, with Century and Owatonna also somewhere in the picture. A number of Big 9 games could shake up the order of the teams trying to keep pace with the Lakevilles.

2AA
5 Edina
(16) Burnsville
(19) Prior Lake
-While Edina remains entrenched at the top, there’s some interesting jockeying going on below them. If Prior Lake can beat both Burnsville and Jefferson down the stretch, they have a legitimate argument for the 2-seed. Jefferson’s win over Burnsville is probably big enough to drive them up to the 4-seed, and there are some scenarios that could send them even higher. Also of interest this past week was Chanhassen’s tie with Holy Angels; with a 1-0-1 record against the Stars, Chanhassen has a good argument for the 5-seed, with AHA relegated to the 6-spot.

3AA
4 Eagan
(20) Apple Valley
-The top two meet for the second time this Thursday, though even an upset by Apple Valley probably wouldn’t be enough to knock Eagan from the top spot. (Eagan won the first meeting 5-0.) With a perfect record against the SEC teams, Eastview probably is looking at the 3-seed. Woodbury has struggled over the past month, weakening their once-decent position in the section and opening the door for a streaking Hastings team to perhaps snatch a good seed. Cretin is also hovering in the 4-6 range.

4AA
10 Hill-Murray
White Bear Lake
-The only real news here is Stillwater’s second win over Roseville, which should lock the Ponies in to the 3-seed and the Raiders at #4. Unlikely to change for the rest of the regular season.

5AA
3 Maple Grove
14 Blaine
(17) Centennial
-Still the same three contenders in the same order we predicted in the preseason. Osseo and Champlin Park will probably end up battling it out for the 4-seed. The Centennial-Maple Grove game this week could make things interesting, though I don’t expect anything too major.

6AA
2 Minnetonka
6 Eden Prairie
8 Wayzata
9 Benilde-St. Margaret’s
-Tonka has beaten Wayzata, Wayzata has beaten EP, and EP has beaten Tonka, so I’m just sticking with overall rankings in judging the top three. Now that those three all have a win against another top team in the section, Benilde will probably have to beat Wayzata to avoid the 4-seed. We’ll see if the second round of Lake games clears things up or just makes things muddier.

7AA
1 Duluth East
12 Andover
13 Grand Rapids
15 Elk River
(18) Cloquet
-Tuesday’s Andover-Elk River game is huge for the seedings; an Andover win might lock them in as the 2-seed, while a loss would confuse things and perhaps open the door for Grand Rapids to sneak a little higher. Elk River must win if they have any hope to be higher than #4, though in my book it would take another bad loss to drop them behind Cloquet.

8AA
7 Moorhead
Bemidji
Brainerd
Roseau
-On paper the Spuds seem comfortably ahead of the next three, though both Bemidji and Roseau gave them one-goal games. With games against Bemidji this Friday and Brainerd next Saturday, Roseau still has time to move back up into the top two. The Moorhead-Bemidji re-match next Saturday could also throw a wrench into the seedings, and Moorhead plays at Brainerd the final week of the season as well. There’s still a lot to be decided here.

[TennJed]

This week: Thurs at #13 Grand Rapids

I think this is scheduled for Sat Feb. 4

[TennJed]

referring to the Moorhead game listed as Thursday

[HShockeywatcher]

AA has been just like A for quite some time in that many teams are locked in the same spot or general area because they are all winning while not playing each other. It is very conceivable for East, Maple Grove and Eagan all to win out, for example. My question for karl, and others: are these teams locked in those spots regardless of what happens around them?
Example, if Edina wins both this week, are they #4 next week behind those 3 or can they leap Eagan (who has lost to both top 10 teams they've played).

I'd have Maple Grove at 2 this week and Edina at 3 if it were me

As always, great job karl. Love to see all the hard work you put in.

[TheHockeyDJ]

I think in 7AA the Semi-final match ups are set up, early game will be Duluth East vs. the winner of Cloquet/Elk River and game 2 Grand Rapids vs. Andover and not sure which one will be the 2 seed.

[CB00]

I think in 7AA the Semi-final match ups are set up, early game will be Duluth East vs. the winner of Cloquet/Elk River and game 2 Grand Rapids vs. Andover and not sure which one will be the 2 seed.

Not so quick to set the seeds. I'm a little confused on what Grand Rapids has done to earn a higher seed or even a higher ranking then ER. What's with the Thunderchicken love fest? Yes ER stumbled against Anoka, but have beaten #13 Rapids, #17 Centennial, #14 Blaine and ties against #6 Eden Prairie and#17 Centennial. What are Rapids big wins this year? Let's see ..... I don't see a single win or tie against a top 20 team..... Lots of games against single A teams. O wait yes they did beat # 18 Cloquet twice. Yup GR should be higher seed then Cloquet, but not ER or Andover. If ER beats Andover on Tuesday, how can anyone argue ER not a 2 seed. If they lose ER should be a three if they don't stumble.

Andover big wins or ties,, #18 Cloquet, #15 ER in OT, tied #3 Maple Grove being outshot 60-27. Yep, Andover should be #12. Wow!...

Don't really understand rapidsrapids or Karl's logic. ER beats GR, should be a higher seed, just as the logic of Andover beat ER, Andover higher seed. If ER wins Tuesday, ER #2, Rapids and Andover can fight for 3-4. Nuffsaid

[TheHockeyDJ]

Andover and Grand Rapids don't have a loss to a 5-12 team (Anoka). They also don't have 7 losses.

[almostashappy]

AA has been just like A for quite some time in that many teams are locked in the same spot or general area because they are all winning while not playing each other. It is very conceivable for East, Maple Grove and Eagan all to win out, for example. My question for karl, and others: are these teams locked in those spots regardless of what happens around them?
Example, if Edina wins both this week, are they #4 next week behind those 3 or can they leap Eagan (who has lost to both top 10 teams they've played).

I'd have Maple Grove at 2 this week and Edina at 3 if it were me

As always, great job karl. Love to see all the hard work you put in.

HS...you lost track of Tonka in your hypothetical...unless you are going to suggest that the Skippers would drop to #5 if Edina beats them this week?

Harping on Eagan because they "lost to both top 10 teams they've played" seems a little petty because (a) the Wildcats "winning out" necessitates beating #10 H-M on Tues and (b) they've beaten #11 LS twice, and the Cougars have been in the top ten over the course of the season. So has Burnsville, for that matter.

I suppose that if Eagan beats the Pioneers and H-M drops out of the top 10 in next week's rankings you'll still claim that the Wildcats haven't beaten a top-ranked team, right?

That said, I will agree that the State Tournament AA seeding meeting could get rather contentious when it comes time to selecting that #4 seed (assuming no surprises in Sections).

[karl(east)]

This week: Thurs at #13 Grand Rapids

I think this is scheduled for Sat Feb. 4

Correct--thanks. I had it right on the GR schedule, but not the Moorhead schedule

To answer HSHW's question, I think Edina can definitely jump over Eagan and Minnetonka if they beat both this week. I can see your argument for dropping Tonka lower, but that win over East is too big for me to ignore.

7AA: Grand Rapids is ahead of Elk River in the rankings mostly because they have avoided bad losses. Against teams in the 10-20 range of the rankings, ER is 3-2-1 while GR is 2-1; I don't see much difference there. The Anoka loss is the really deciding factor.

As for seeding, one can certainly make the argument that Elk River should be ahead of Grand Rapids. Still, I'm going to guess that the coaches will value overall work ahead of a mid-December game in which Rapids was missing its best player. Also, if we want to be really cynical, we can note that the northern teams in 7AA tend to get seeding boosts that they may not deserve, according to the strict logic we seem to employ when seeding on here. (Cloquet last year is an obvious example.)

[TheHockeyDJ]

I think given the Anoka loss, we could also argue Cloquet over Elk River in the seedings, meaning a long bus trip for the Elks for the quarterfinals. I like followthepuck.com's rankings.

[HShockeywatcher]

AA has been just like A for quite some time in that many teams are locked in the same spot or general area because they are all winning while not playing each other. It is very conceivable for East, Maple Grove and Eagan all to win out, for example. My question for karl, and others: are these teams locked in those spots regardless of what happens around them?
Example, if Edina wins both this week, are they #4 next week behind those 3 or can they leap Eagan (who has lost to both top 10 teams they've played).

I'd have Maple Grove at 2 this week and Edina at 3 if it were me

As always, great job karl. Love to see all the hard work you put in.

HS...you lost track of Tonka in your hypothetical...unless you are going to suggest that the Skippers would drop to #5 if Edina beats them this week?

Harping on Eagan because they "lost to both top 10 teams they've played" seems a little petty because (a) the Wildcats "winning out" necessitates beating #10 H-M on Tues and (b) they've beaten #11 LS twice, and the Cougars have been in the top ten over the course of the season. So has Burnsville, for that matter.

I suppose that if Eagan beats the Pioneers and H-M drops out of the top 10 in next week's rankings you'll still claim that the Wildcats haven't beaten a top-ranked team, right?

That said, I will agree that the State Tournament AA seeding meeting could get rather contentious when it comes time to selecting that #4 seed (assuming no surprises in Sections).

If these were my rankings, I'd have Tonka at 4 with MG and Edina ahead of them and Eagan at 5. In my hypothetical, that's what I'm asking.

I'm not "harping on them," merely commenting on what they've done this season. Based on where they were ranked in the preseason, they should have no losses right now...

How do you look at them and their schedule? Their best win is over Lakeville South; they are victim of a weak schedule. It is tough to determine what it means when teams win; they will get to state with ONE top ten win. The hub even has them at #3, 6 spots above EP.

What are your thoughts? I was more asking for opinions than stating mine, as I don't have a strong one. I think a case could be justified to have an unseeded 26-2 Eagan and a case could possibly be made for seeding them as high as #2 depending on who else makes it. It's all about perspective.

[CB00]

I think given the Anoka loss, we could also argue Cloquet over Elk River in the seedings, meaning a long bus trip for the Elks for the quarterfinals. I like followthepuck.com's rankings.

ER 3. GR 2. Nuff said

Karl I don't necessarily agree with East over Tonka. If I remember it was only 7 days ago East got thumped by Tonka. Tonka lost to a very good Eden Prairie team, don't really feel East should jump ahead because the beat Flake. Just my opinion. I bet you couldn't wait for Tonka to stumble so you could quickly get your Hounds back at #1

[tonkafan77]

The Lake Conference teams are all up in the air as of now. This week, with both the EP/Edina and the Tonka/Edina games, will give us a better idea of how these three teams stand. I don't think dropping Minnetonka out of the top 2 is necessary as of now. Their 3 losses have been to very good teams and in each of these games, they have outshot the other team handily and in EP and Edina's case, have lost in the last minute or so. This week will for sure give us another look at these key match-ups.

[green4]

I think given the Anoka loss, we could also argue Cloquet over Elk River in the seedings, meaning a long bus trip for the Elks for the quarterfinals. I like followthepuck.com's rankings.

ER 3. GR 2. Nuff said

Karl I don't necessarily agree with East over Tonka. If I remember it was only 7 days ago East got thumped by Tonka. Tonka lost to a very good Eden Prairie team, don't really feel East should jump ahead because the beat Flake. Just my opinion. I bet you couldn't wait for Tonka to stumble so you could quickly get your Hounds back at #1

give the guy a break, its a tough job and he does a great job every week i mean he can't make everyone happy and what do you want him to do? keep tonka at #1 when they have lost 2 games in 2 weeks to #5 and #6. there is more of a argument that tonka should be lower than still at number 1. great rankings Karl keep up the good work!

[slyer]

looks to me that er has the 9th sos and gr has fallen down to 19th tied with anoka, and with another 4 class a teams to play they won't even be in the top 20 by the end of the season. lotta wins but very few good ones

[almostashappy]

If these were my rankings, I'd have Tonka at 4 with MG and Edina ahead of them and Eagan at 5. In my hypothetical, that's what I'm asking.

I'm not "harping on them," merely commenting on what they've done this season. Based on where they were ranked in the preseason, they should have no losses right now...

How do you look at them and their schedule? Their best win is over Lakeville South; they are victim of a weak schedule. It is tough to determine what it means when teams win; they will get to state with ONE top ten win. The hub even has them at #3, 6 spots above EP.

What are your thoughts? I was more asking for opinions than stating mine, as I don't have a strong one. I think a case could be justified to have an unseeded 26-2 Eagan and a case could possibly be made for seeding them as high as #2 depending on who else makes it. It's all about perspective.

My thoughts? Well, I think that better hockey minds than mine are in a better position to make these sorts of rankings, and I really appreciate all of the hard work that Karl puts into these weekly posts.

[karl(east)]

looks to me that er has the 9th sos and gr has fallen down to 19th tied with anoka, and with another 4 class a teams to play they won't even be in the top 20 by the end of the season. lotta wins but very few good ones

While this is true, the same rankings that those SOS numbers come from have Grand Rapids ranked #11 in AA and Elk River at #15.

Karl I don't necessarily agree with East over Tonka. If I remember it was only 7 days ago East got thumped by Tonka. Tonka lost to a very good Eden Prairie team, don't really feel East should jump ahead because the beat Flake. Just my opinion. I bet you couldn't wait for Tonka to stumble so you could quickly get your Hounds back at #1

How many games is Tonka allowed to lose before we punish them in the rankings? They've obviously shown they can beat anyone in the state when they're playing well, but they have two more losses than East with practically the same SOS to date. East managed to beat that very good Eden Prairie team a few weeks ago. Despite the East win, Tonka is 2-2 in their last four games, all against the sorts of teams they'll have to beat to get out of 6AA and through the state tournament. That's not bad, but it definitely does not scream "#1" to me.

And yes, obviously my sole goal with these rankings is to find the quickest way to get East back to the top. They obviously don't get enough attention on this forum or around the state already and need me to prop them up at every opportunity.

[Turk182]

Karl…

Honestly I don’t see how Tonka stays at #2. Here’s a team that gave up 5 goals to Duluth East in the first period of the Schwan’s Cup and eventually lost 6-2. That doesn’t sound much different than losing 9-3 considering the circumstances. I don’t understand why that loss seems to have such a bearing on your weekly rankings. In the last four games Tonka is currently 2-2. Even though they were games against some very good competition a loss is a loss.

Am I trying to change your mind? No, I just don’t understand what method or rational you use to come up with you rankings this week.

Obviously Karl you do a great job with the rankings. Do I disagree at times? Yes

My top five
1. DE
2. Grove
3. Edina
4. Tonka
5. EP

P.S. I don't know if I can take anymore of your boasting about Duluth East!!

[northwoods oldtimer]

I think in 7AA the Semi-final match ups are set up, early game will be Duluth East vs. the winner of Cloquet/Elk River and game 2 Grand Rapids vs. Andover and not sure which one will be the 2 seed.

Not so quick to set the seeds. I'm a little confused on what Grand Rapids has done to earn a higher seed or even a higher ranking then ER. What's with the Thunderchicken love fest? Yes ER stumbled against Anoka, but have beaten #13 Rapids, #17 Centennial, #14 Blaine and ties against #6 Eden Prairie and#17 Centennial. What are Rapids big wins this year? Let's see ..... I don't see a single win or tie against a top 20 team..... Lots of games against single A teams. O wait yes they did beat # 18 Cloquet twice. Yup GR should be higher seed then Cloquet, but not ER or Andover. If ER beats Andover on Tuesday, how can anyone argue ER not a 2 seed. If they lose ER should be a three if they don't stumble.

Andover big wins or ties,, #18 Cloquet, #15 ER in OT, tied #3 Maple Grove being outshot 60-27. Yep, Andover should be #12. Wow!...

Don't really understand rapidsrapids or Karl's logic. ER beats GR, should be a higher seed, just as the logic of Andover beat ER, Andover higher seed. If ER wins Tuesday, ER #2, Rapids and Andover can fight for 3-4. Nuffsaid

Hard to get a clear picture of an Elk River (or Andover for that matter) who appear to avoid playing any 7AA section games (took Duluth East Forest Lake and Cloquet off the schedule). I understand the head to head but how much weights does one 3 - 2 overtime win in December give a team? If you agree that it carries a lot of weight the defense to that argument is penalzing a team a bit for only playing 4 section games (2 with Andover, St. Francis, Rapids)

Maybe some unbiased opinions in the ranking systems have set the ranks correct (to date) as it is a challenge to hang much credible value on such limited section games. Which is why it should be a requirement to play minimum of one time each team in a section.

Looks like Karl has his ranks where the other site have them for the section.

http://minnesota-high-school-hockey.blo ... _9588.html

http://www.minnesota-scores.net/classst ... 09&class=3

[Hounds19]

I think in 7AA the Semi-final match ups are set up, early game will be Duluth East vs. the winner of Cloquet/Elk River and game 2 Grand Rapids vs. Andover and not sure which one will be the 2 seed.

Not so quick to set the seeds. I'm a little confused on what Grand Rapids has done to earn a higher seed or even a higher ranking then ER. What's with the Thunderchicken love fest? Yes ER stumbled against Anoka, but have beaten #13 Rapids, #17 Centennial, #14 Blaine and ties against #6 Eden Prairie and#17 Centennial. What are Rapids big wins this year? Let's see ..... I don't see a single win or tie against a top 20 team..... Lots of games against single A teams. O wait yes they did beat # 18 Cloquet twice. Yup GR should be higher seed then Cloquet, but not ER or Andover. If ER beats Andover on Tuesday, how can anyone argue ER not a 2 seed. If they lose ER should be a three if they don't stumble.

Andover big wins or ties,, #18 Cloquet, #15 ER in OT, tied #3 Maple Grove being outshot 60-27. Yep, Andover should be #12. Wow!...

Don't really understand rapidsrapids or Karl's logic. ER beats GR, should be a higher seed, just as the logic of Andover beat ER, Andover higher seed. If ER wins Tuesday, ER #2, Rapids and Andover can fight for 3-4. Nuffsaid

Hard to get a clear picture of an Elk River (or Andover for that matter) who appear to avoid playing any 7AA section games (took Duluth East Forest Lake and Cloquet off the schedule). I understand the head to head but how much weights does one 3 - 2 overtime win in December give a team? If you agree that it carries a lot of weight the defense to that argument is penalzing a team a bit for only playing 4 section games (2 with Andover, St. Francis, Rapids)

Maybe some unbiased opinions in the ranking systems have set the ranks correct (to date) as it is a challenge to hang much credible value on such limited section games. Which is why it should be a requirement to play minimum of one time each team in a section.

Looks like Karl has his ranks where the other site have them for the section.

http://minnesota-high-school-hockey.blo ... _9588.html

http://www.minnesota-scores.net/classst ... 09&class=3

Obviously karl wants east at the top, as do i, its in our blood to root for our beloved hounds. but i believe that is where they belong. Sure they lost to tonka badly, but they also beat them handily, so to me, it is a wash. also, if you take tonkas loses into consideration, i think they should have fallen a little more. maple grove has proven themselves throughout the season, and deserves a tad more credit. and as much as i hate to say it, so does edina. they are exceeding expectations for a young team. i would put both ahead of tonka at this point, and possible even eagan, but not quite yet. If edina wins both tought games this week, i would made a strong case to put them a nukber 2, that is as long as east doesnt choke badly again. the rankings could be a little different, but kudos to karl for another great ranking.

[NWSC Puck]

Not so quick to set the seeds. I'm a little confused on what Grand Rapids has done to earn a higher seed or even a higher ranking then ER. What's with the Thunderchicken love fest? Yes ER stumbled against Anoka, but have beaten #13 Rapids, #17 Centennial, #14 Blaine and ties against #6 Eden Prairie and#17 Centennial. What are Rapids big wins this year? Let's see ..... I don't see a single win or tie against a top 20 team..... Lots of games against single A teams. O wait yes they did beat # 18 Cloquet twice. Yup GR should be higher seed then Cloquet, but not ER or Andover. If ER beats Andover on Tuesday, how can anyone argue ER not a 2 seed. If they lose ER should be a three if they don't stumble.

Andover big wins or ties,, #18 Cloquet, #15 ER in OT, tied #3 Maple Grove being outshot 60-27. Yep, Andover should be #12. Wow!...

Don't really understand rapidsrapids or Karl's logic. ER beats GR, should be a higher seed, just as the logic of Andover beat ER, Andover higher seed. If ER wins Tuesday, ER #2, Rapids and Andover can fight for 3-4. Nuffsaid

Hard to get a clear picture of an Elk River (or Andover for that matter) who appear to avoid playing any 7AA section games (took Duluth East Forest Lake and Cloquet off the schedule). I understand the head to head but how much weights does one 3 - 2 overtime win in December give a team? If you agree that it carries a lot of weight the defense to that argument is penalzing a team a bit for only playing 4 section games (2 with Andover, St. Francis, Rapids)

Maybe some unbiased opinions in the ranking systems have set the ranks correct (to date) as it is a challenge to hang much credible value on such limited section games. Which is why it should be a requirement to play minimum of one time each team in a section.

Looks like Karl has his ranks where the other site have them for the section.

http://minnesota-high-school-hockey.blo ... _9588.html

http://www.minnesota-scores.net/classst ... 09&class=3

Obviously karl wants east at the top, as do i, its in our blood to root for our beloved hounds. but i believe that is where they belong. Sure they lost to tonka badly, but they also beat them handily, so to me, it is a wash. also, if you take tonkas loses into consideration, i think they should have fallen a little more. maple grove has proven themselves throughout the season, and deserves a tad more credit. and as much as i hate to say it, so does edina. they are exceeding expectations for a young team. i would put both ahead of tonka at this point, and possible even eagan, but not quite yet. If edina wins both tought games this week, i would made a strong case to put them a nukber 2, that is as long as east doesnt choke badly again. the rankings could be a little different, but kudos to karl for another great ranking.

The reason that Andover and Elk River dont play many section 7AA games is they our part of a huge conference that if they play every team twice takes up 20 games. Andover and ER were also forced to play EP by the mshsl on a cross over conference game. Andover than scheduled East in a early season game which east won 6-1. and in their holiday tourney they played another section opponent in Cloquet. ER scheduled a weak st franny team and than played GR in their holiday tourney. That is why they dont play many section 7AA games.

[tonkafan77]

As of now, I don't see the logic of theoretically putting Edina ahead of Minnetonka...as of now that is. They've played each other twice. The first time Tonka put them in running time- 6-0. The second time, Tonka had twice the shots but had a bad bounce with just a minute left in the game and lost 3-2. Like I said, things could change come Saturday but I highly doubt Tonka will lose that one after what Edina did at Pagel.

As for Eagan and Maple Grove, Tonka deserves to stay ahead of Eagan because of their only head to head match up earlier in the season of 4-2. Since then, Eagan hasn't played any major teams to show that thy should be higher. And for MG, the number two spot is really up in the air. If only Minnetonka played them at the end of the year and not Buffalo.

Like I said earlier, things are muddy right now and hopefully this week in the Lake Conference clears things up a little.

[karl(east)]

The reason that Andover and Elk River dont play many section 7AA games is they our part of a huge conference that if they play every team twice takes up 20 games. Andover and ER were also forced to play EP by the mshsl on a cross over conference game. Andover than scheduled East in a early season game which east won 6-1. and in their holiday tourney they played another section opponent in Cloquet. ER scheduled a weak st franny team and than played GR in their holiday tourney. That is why they dont play many section 7AA games.

Elk River was on an early version of the East schedule; did the MSHSL's assignment of the crossover game force the change? If so, that's unfortunate--and also unnecessary, since ER and EP wound up playing each other three times in the first month and a half of the season.

It's interesting to see the differing perspectives on Minnetonka, and following the strict logic several people have spelled out, it's easy to see how they could be ranked somewhere in the 3-5 range. Still, I think their dominance over the course of the season speaks for itself. I've watched them play a number of times now (including two of their losses), and though they have not been as steady as a Maple Grove, I think they are a bit more dangerous than the Crimson when they're going at full speed. Plus, I think we can allow for a little bit of inconsistency around now, especially against very tough schedules--anyone else remember how some of the great Edina teams over the past few years have hit a sudden, inexplicable rough patch in late January? That certainly didn't hurt the 2010 Hornets.

If this trend continues, bigger questions will arise. With one more loss I agree the Skippers will drop to #4 or so, but I don't want to put the cart in front of the horse. We'll see how they do against Edina.

[icehornet]

My top five
1. DE
2. Grove
3. Edina
4. Tonka
5. EP

Always enjoy reading your rankings Karl and you do a great job with the write-ups. I reference back to this thread several times each week to see who is playing who and how teams stack up. That said, I agree with the quoted rankings. Eagan is very solid on paper and they have a good record, but unfortunately it's difficult to put them ahead of anyone in the this top 5 when they don't play those teams. The teams listed play a very difficult schedule and see each other multiple times during the year. I'm not saying that Eagan doesn't boast the pedigree as these teams this year, we just don't know how they measure up (for now.)

[gopherpuck516]

My top five
1. DE
2. Grove
3. Edina
4. Tonka
5. EP

Always enjoy reading your rankings Karl and you do a great job with the write-ups. I reference back to this thread several times each week to see who is playing who and how teams stack up. That said, I agree with the quoted rankings. Eagan is very solid on paper and they have a good record, but unfortunately it's difficult to put them ahead of anyone in the this top 5 when they don't play those teams. The teams listed play a very difficult schedule and see each other multiple times during the year. I'm not saying that Eagan doesn't boast the pedigree as these teams this year, we just don't know how they measure up (for now.)

I'm an Eagan fan, but I have to agree with your post. Their lack of victories over top 5 caliber teams keeps them out of the top 5 for now. Had they beat EP in their early season match-up they would now be 18-1 and there's no way they wouldn't be considered a top 5 team, but they lost that game and sit at 17-2 and have no wins over a top 5 team. Yes, they've beat Lakeville South twice and dominated Burnsville, but they have some work to do to convince people they can beat a top ranked team. They have a chance to make a statement this week though, playing at Hill Murray. If they can outplay HM at Aldrich and get a victory that will give them another quality win. Unfortunately they won't face another top ranked team after that, so the only way they'll be able to prove they belong there, if they truly do, is to win their Section and show what they've got at State.