Elite Players, League, Opportunities

East Hockey Puck
Posts: 71
Joined: Tue Nov 18, 2003 6:45 pm

Elite Players, League, Opportunities

Post by East Hockey Puck » Tue Nov 18, 2003 6:45 pm

I would love to see a detailed discussion about the following:<br>Does the success of the Elite high school league give elite players the opportunity to develop and increase their opportunities while staying home and playing high school hockey?<br>If an elite player plays for a top notch program (team is recognized, players develop, tough schedule, frequent trips to the State tournament) does this increase the odds of him staying home? <br>Does it diminish his chances of being noticed?<br>Does it seem that the elite players who are at Shattuck, BSM, Breck etc.. come from weaker programs, or from programs that have been weakened by previous departures (Jefferson)?<br>Are there many players who are at Shattuck, BSM, Breck, etc. from successful programs?<br>If a player plays with an elite group of players from his own area is he going to continue to receive the accolades he deserves, or if he leaves might he get lost in the shuffle of Juniors, Shattuck etc?<br>Looking forward to your responses. <p></p><i></i>

joe lulic
Posts: 284
Joined: Mon Jul 29, 2002 1:30 pm

no way to know

Post by joe lulic » Wed Nov 19, 2003 9:28 am

Who knows. <br>The longer I am around, the more I believe that the biggest factor is genetics and the second is desire to get better and everything else is bull$#^t.<br>There have been a lot of great players who have come out of weak programs. Not all of the players who "make it" play all summer nor in the Elite programs. <br><br>All we really know is that kids with great natural ability who enjoy the game enough to work on it do just fine. The rest is anybodies guess. <p></p><i></i>

Dons
Posts: 101
Joined: Mon Oct 27, 2003 10:35 pm

Re: no way to know

Post by Dons » Wed Nov 19, 2003 9:41 am

East Hockey-<br>Look back to a thread called Top Players from last year and wehre they are now. i beleive thats wat its called. its 3 pages of debate on juniors and the elite league. unless of course you wanted to be involved in teh thread, that one will answer all your questions. <p></p><i></i>

bdabbt75
Posts: 78
Joined: Tue Mar 05, 2002 12:04 pm

Re: Elite Players, League, Opportunities

Post by bdabbt75 » Wed Nov 19, 2003 11:09 am

if you 'love' it, then you need to scan the archives;-)<br><br>my short answers<br><br>Elite league... has not changed a thing. players are moving to juniors and/or other teams based on the same factors at the same rate. All it has done is remove the Project Prep practice time from effectively the same model that existed 3 years ago. <br><br>one factor for less movement: I do think that the USHL is not the 'open door' it used to be for good HS age MN players... because West Coast, Canadian, and European players are flooding the league. I think more kids are staying home because there are fewer slots available.<br><br>if an elite (defined by me as D1 potential ... not 'selected by the elite program'), has all those benefits, no. it doesn't improve his chances to stay home... cases in point Lourdes' harrington and duncan, AHA's frazee. If the day to day competition is not challenging, these kids are advised to move to the next level. <br><br>diminish his chances of being noticed if he stays home... if he has the above, no. In fact, if you're good, and you stay home, you'll get noticed, minimally by Jnr A Tier II teams. For a few kids, the question will be 'how will he perform at the next level?' <br><br>A couple cases in point from last year... Lundin at Apple Valley... no elite program... now is in the D rotation for a top 5 D1 program. Thauwald at Mayo: 2nd Line at #6CC, Brunkhorst from Lourdes: 4th line at CC, again no elite program. I think all of these were 'right kid at the right time,' since all of them were late committments. But it does tell you these kids were scouted and remembered, even though they weren't an 'early signer.'<br><br>The counter of this is Kevin Huck... Kev is a great player, definitely better at many hockey things than brunkhorst, and often considered a peer to thauwald when they skated in Rochester on the same bantam team. He's an AHA State Champ Alum. but he has bounced around the USHL, and is now in NAHL. He's still putting up numbers, but hasn't gotten a committment yet. Why is that? He did the Elites, he was on 4 state tourney teams, he's a state champ, he played the big AHA program? my only guess is he's not a 'fit' anywhere right now.<br><br>'weakened' departures (you used it twice). kids move for a bunch of reasons... I think the major one is to get to the HS tournament, another... to get a coach that meets their needs. Do Elites move from weak programs only... no... I think the move pretty much to/from programs based on a lot of reasons (see kids moving from edina to orono, BSM to wayzata as examples).<br><br>accolades do not equal 'getting noticed' going to juniors, going to shattuck is a different hockey forum. there, the 'buzz' is not in the local newspaper, or on channel 9 news. Scouts and coaches look intently at each player in juniors/shattuck, likely moreso than HS skaters, because the competition is more stiff.<br><br>Bottom line... if you're good, you'll get noticed by the 'next level' whereever you play, and if not, there are plenty of Jnr A TierII teams that would have you if you have the talent. If you think you need a better team or a different coach to make you look better, you're probably not good enough for your goals of playing beyond juniors (again, assuming that elite = D1 caliber). <br><br>As stated previously, hockey smarts, heart, hard work, and physical abilities (in that order... assuming you meet the 'physical ability minimum bar') are what the successful coaches/scouts at the next level most likely look for. <br><br>oh... and for D1 programs... they are looking for scholar athletes and moral citizens... they can't burn a scholarship on an ineligible player (as is the rumor with Weber). You better be as tenacious in the classroom as you are on the ice.<br><br>-bud<br> <p></p><i>Edited by: <A HREF=http://pub33.ezboard.com/bmnhs.showUser ... dabbt75</A> at: 11/19/03 11:23 am<br></i>

atthepoint
Posts: 42
Joined: Sat Nov 15, 2003 8:04 pm

Re: Elite Players, League, Opportunities

Post by atthepoint » Wed Nov 19, 2003 5:36 pm

bdabbt75,<br>Outstandiong post. <p></p><i></i>

Sioux Fan
Posts: 552
Joined: Fri Aug 22, 2003 2:56 pm
Location: Rochester, MN

Re: Elite Players, League, Opportunities

Post by Sioux Fan » Wed Nov 19, 2003 11:18 pm

Kevin needs to learn how to battle and compete. He has a lot of skill and can really skate. Now he needs to battle. That is what missing the ability of our HS and elite program to teach and demand that the players battle and compete...<br><br>It is not good enough to annoint them they have to earn it every day in practice..<br>Then they will own it and have a better chance to succeed. It ain't easy....<br><br><br>Lundin was coached by Westrum and I think that helped him get ready to play at Maine..<br><br>I like Kevin and he can do it. But he needs to decide how bad he wants to win the battles night in and night out.<br><br>It would be better if he had to do it for the past three or four years and then it would be 2nd nature. That is what I want to do have the best kids learn to battle and win and succeed. It is that simple or that hard depending on the player.. Some guys are natural competitors. Don Granato told me that all he looks for is the true competitors. He knows he can teach them how to play smart he can't teach them to compete. You can show them that they aren't competing but the player has to decide to compete.<br><br> <p>Hockey Nut in So. MN</p><i></i>

mnhshock29
Posts: 34
Joined: Sun Sep 14, 2003 11:02 pm

elite

Post by mnhshock29 » Thu Nov 20, 2003 12:15 am

Like Kevin Huck, Scott Thauwald spent his entire fall playing in the HS Elite Hockey program. The buzz is also coming from NHL, college and Junior A scouts who attend each HS Elite weekend in large numbers. They love the league because it gives them their best opportunity to evaluate players--seeing them going against the best of the best, with the best of the best at one site. Last year 35 HS age kids left the state to play juniors, this year the number decreased to around 10. Anyone who attended a weekend and saw Junior A scouts work after a game in actively pursuing players could tell you that this decrease is not due to an influx of players elsewhere, but rather the newfound ability of MN players to cite a different option that allows them to develop while staying in their HS. <p></p><i></i>

bdabbt75
Posts: 78
Joined: Tue Mar 05, 2002 12:04 pm

Re: elite

Post by bdabbt75 » Thu Nov 20, 2003 8:46 am

re: thauwald...<br><br>and your point is... he had pretty much committed to HS hockey the year before (by playing track and field instead of going to Juniors in the spring). and you invited the kid to elites. And he gave up Football, counter to what you promote your league to provide... I'm getting no really good poster boy from this example. <br><br>(note: I'm arguing this although I know his body was arguably 'fragile' when it came to football... his decision was likely very sound... his heart was too big for his bones when it came to a 'collision' sport)<br><br>Of course the Junior scouts are at the tourney games... I never said they weren't. However, last year the message was this league was focused on D1 recruiting (quotes from Dahl, etc)... now it appears your backtracking on that a bit, and USHL recruiting is a major benefit. Can you guys stay on point here? I seem to feel this is just one big marketing campaign ('wheres the beef';-)<br><br>'Anyone?' 'a new option' and now tell me... how does this differ from Project Prep in the eyes of a scout? oh please... <br><br>note that elites couldn't hold duncan or harrington to Lourdes this year, so I can just as easily state that your league 'actively' promoted their exit to Juniors (given your new argument that moving Elites to Juniors is a positive of your league), which is counter to the other benefits you seem to be arguing.<br><br>(again, I'm not saying their choice wasn't right... I'm just saying your league isn't batting 1.000 in your primary messages)<br><br>-bud <p></p><i></i>

eagle73
Posts: 13
Joined: Wed Nov 05, 2003 3:33 pm

elite:

Post by eagle73 » Thu Nov 20, 2003 9:03 am

And then theres Pauer, who takes a spot on an elite roster and jumps to Juniors after the tourney. <p></p><i></i>

Sioux Fan
Posts: 552
Joined: Fri Aug 22, 2003 2:56 pm
Location: Rochester, MN

Maybe the USHL didn't want more than 10

Post by Sioux Fan » Thu Nov 20, 2003 9:20 am

It just may be that the other areas are getting more of the Tier one slots due to the age and the ability of the MN player to be ready to contribute.<br><br>I think that 15 and 16 year olds have lot's of issues other than hockey to worry about being away from their parental guidance. <br>That is why I think we need to enhance the development of our HS players regarding the tight checking physical requirements of Jr. A Hockey.<br><br>I don't think the annointment process is true or developmental. I think a minor and major regional midget program in 5 or 6 areas would be best. Areas could be adjusted if competitive levels are not deemed adequate.<br><br>I think it would be up to the regional directors coaches and players to develop and field a competitive team.<br><br>I think that this would be better and we could be consistant in working on individual players weaknesses and strengths as we would have a program for each player to help them achieve their individual goals.<br><br>I know it would be great. The Elite program is a great step but let's try to make it better and better. I think adding competition for roster spots and regional pride would be great additions.<br><br>JCN <p></p><i></i>

bdabbt75
Posts: 78
Joined: Tue Mar 05, 2002 12:04 pm

Re: pauer

Post by bdabbt75 » Thu Nov 20, 2003 9:48 am

hmmm, I didn't know that...<br><br>he wouldn't have been a great poster boy for 'staying home and playing HS hockey' either. <p></p><i></i>

PureTrick
Posts: 3
Joined: Thu Nov 20, 2003 1:02 pm

Re: elite

Post by PureTrick » Thu Nov 20, 2003 1:02 pm

bdabbt75 you need to get your facts straight!<br><br>When I read your first post on this thread I found some of your assesments to be valid but thought you used the worst possible examples of players to make your point. You also seem to be bitter about the Elite League for some reason. The league has given alot of players exposure at the next level that they might have had difficulty gaining while playing in high school. I agree with your statement that if a kid has talent he will most likely be found because talent shines through. But, the league makes it a lot easier for colleges and Juniors to compare apples to apples and see how some kid who score 40 goals playing against Our Lady of the Empty Net does against real competition.<br><br>In that regard you did a diservice because Thauwald did play in the league last year as did Harrington and Duncan. You talk about kids moving to weaker programs but used two pretty poor examples, the kid I think you mean went from Edina to Orono because he was playing 3rd or 4 th line there, scored like one varsity goal and saw no future there. He didnt do well in Model Camp nor the Elite League this year according to the stats nor was he asked to play on the AllStar teams. My sources tell me your BSM example was asked to leave the school. But when talking about Elite players I think you need to talk aout the upper half of the league to make valid comparisons. Huck's case distorts the league issues yet again. He is a talented player, but I overheard two Junior coaches discussing him once and they were not pleased with his attitude and coachability. <br><br>You are right when commenting on the Project Prep emphasis on practice compared to the Elite's many games, but they do seem to be evolving. No one bats 1000, and some kids will leave no matter what but get the facts straight, Pauer didnt "jump" to Juniors he went for a weekend to play while waiting his appeal to the high school league to be decided, I heard he is back in school in Orono now. If it were not for the Elite league he would have been forced to go to juniors but stayed and fought the process in order to try and play high school. Harrington and Duncan were not happy with all the driving last year and lack of practices.<br><br>You seem bitter toward some of the gifted kids, maybe you can end this thread on a positive note and name a POSTER boy?? The Elite league did keep kids here and has helped develope talent.<br><br>Want some names?? Try Hovick, or Phil Johnson, or Duetz, or Greer. or Marple.. all good kids and players who gained this year by participating. <p></p><i>Edited by: <A HREF=http://pub33.ezboard.com/bmnhs.showUser ... reTrick</A> at: 11/20/03 1:26 pm<br></i>

East Hockey Puck
Posts: 71
Joined: Tue Nov 18, 2003 6:45 pm

Re: elite

Post by East Hockey Puck » Thu Nov 20, 2003 1:52 pm

It is interesting the different spins that people can take on these issues as well as about individual players. <br>One direction I am curious, is about the future and the influence that some of our younger players 9th and 10th graders are receiving. <br>With Mueller and his family going out and seeking and receiving a commitment from the Gophers as a 15 year old the bar has been been raised (or lowered) again. Look at the Hagemo situation. Families representatives at 15? Is there too much pressure being placed by our local sports agents at too young of an age? Is this forcing families and players into making decisions at way to early of an age? For the most part I cant believe this is healthy for players or programs.<br>For the special and extremely talented MN hockey players this might be appropriate but how many Broten, Housley, Crowley type players are there in MN and how many are there in any given year. <p></p><i>Edited by: <A HREF=http://pub33.ezboard.com/bmnhs.showUser ... @mnhs>East Hockey Puck</A> at: 11/20/03 1:53 pm<br></i>

joe lulic
Posts: 284
Joined: Mon Jul 29, 2002 1:30 pm

Fair Comment

Post by joe lulic » Thu Nov 20, 2003 1:58 pm

PureTrick, I dont have anything against the Elite League. It is what it is and people will get out of it whatever they want. But statements are made about it that raise <br>eyebrows. "It has given a lot of players exposure that they MIGHT not have had" What does that mean? Who has gone on to have great opportunities that they wouldnt have had? <br>" The Elite League did keep kids here and has helped develop talent." I hope the league isnt taking credit for the talent devlopment of the Minnesota player. Do you claim that kids had their bags packed for Jrs. but unpacked as soon as they heard about the Elite league?Is the Elite league a substitute for Juniors?<br><br>Maybe to some degree the statements are accurate but I think some are made a little to casually. <br><br>Again, I dont have anything against it. If we are bent on staying with the MSHSL for our development, then we have to have something. But I would be more conservative about what the elite league provides. <br><br> <p></p><i></i>

Whatwillwork
Posts: 57
Joined: Mon Sep 15, 2003 8:44 am

Elite League

Post by Whatwillwork » Fri Nov 21, 2003 6:39 pm

Well, the EL does keep players playing here instead of making the drive to Lincoln, Des Moines or what not on the weekend for a couple of games and then coming back for school in the fall like Guyer did for example. It also allows other players to play against better competition in the fall to improve their game instead of playing a lower class fall league. I think the Elite League is a good idea that I hope expands and allows for a couple more teams in the future. Playing those extra games has got to help the development of the players and some of them instead of playing Div 3 end up getting a Div 1 scholarship. <p></p><i></i>

bdabbt75
Posts: 78
Joined: Tue Mar 05, 2002 12:04 pm

Re: Elite League

Post by bdabbt75 » Mon Nov 24, 2003 12:02 am

<!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>bdabbt75 you need to get your facts straight!<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br><br>.... you need to reread my post. I stand by my facts in their context.<br><br>you may have better facts , but most prove my point just as well.<br><br>and, while taking them out of context, your opinions/observations damn the league even more.<br><br><!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr> ....against Our Lady of the Empty Net does against real competition.<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br><br>...and how does section 7 in Project Prep equate to Our Lady of Empty Net? let's stay on point here... I have nothing against fall skills development. I certainly have nothing against the kids.<br><br>I have some issues with the elite league format, the bullying of MNHockey to coerce other options out of existence (my opinion... hard to get facts in a conspiracy), and in general that elite hockey hockey's attempt to 'market itself' into a position of 'success.' And I truly believe (no facts) that this program is a resume builder for several people who aren't 100% in it for the kids.<br><br><!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>In that regard you did a diservice because Thauwald did play in the league last year as did Harrington and Duncan. <hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END-->.<br><br>and I stated that they did play. several times. read my post.<br><br><!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>. Harrington and Duncan were not happy with all the driving last year and lack of practices<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END-->.<br><br>and the project prep model, designed around more practices 'in the section', would be less driving per hour of ice. <br><br>keep this up, and I'll be asking you to write my posts.<br><br>Wasn't that the goal... keeping kids at home to play hockey? I don't disagree with their move. Class A hockey probably wouldn't get them ready for the next level ('our lady of the empty net'... my Mom would like that). MNHSHOCKEY comes on here and now says that getting players to juniors is a goal? when last year it was getting them D1 exposure without having the junior route? I saw this as a change in 'spin' that now Duncan and Harrington could be considered 'successes' instead of failure of Elite hockey to meet the needs of elite players.<br><br>last year beaverson[sp?] was considered a success only when he was ranked in the NHL central scouting list... again, they succeeded even though they didn't keep him in HS hockey.<br><br>Fact is... elite hockey is just another set of comparison games to help kids and scouts decide if their are good enough to move to the next level. other than the format, it does nothing to keep kids in HS. <br><br><!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>You talk about kids moving to weaker programs but used two pretty poor examples, the kid I think you mean went from Edina to Orono because he was playing 3rd or 4 th line there, scored like one varsity goal and saw no future there. He didnt do well in Model Camp nor the Elite League this year according to the stats nor was he asked to play on the AllStar teams.<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br><br>here's a kid, a model camp invitee, an elite team member, and he's moved from school to school. fact. <br><br>is he elite or not? or is he a political appointee (coaches recommendation)? <br><br>as for your other note. I'm sorry you mentioned it. That shouldn't be posted here. I've been roasted for my opinions on athletes such as those, suffice it to say, I consider elite athletes elite in all manners, respectful of their talents and responsibilities.<br><br>... <br><!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>But when talking about Elite players I think you need to talk aout the upper half of the league to make valid comparisons.<!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr><br><br>aka... the sure things. that's 50 kids give or take. 7 per team. <br>Why focus on them? explain. <br><br><!--EZCODE FONT START--><span style="font-family:helvetica;font-size:x-large;">MY WHOLE POINT IS THE OTHER 50!</span><!--EZCODE FONT END--><br><br>and the 50 below them. and the next 50 after that? These are the kids trying to make a name for themselves... these are the kids trying to get out of our lady of the empty net into elk river or Tri Cities. The top fifty... hell most of them have 3 Jnr A tenders in their pockets now. if you're saying they're staying because of elite hockey... I'm saying their staying because their HS team has a chance to play 'in the show' and the 'U' has it's recruiting class full until 2006 anyway, so I'll be playing juniors after I graduate anyway.<br><br>I'm a grassroots guy. I'd rather have 200 very good players, rather than 50 elite, and 150 not so good... why... I'm a long term guy. in 10 years those 200 would teach 200 other kids at each of their schools how to work hard, what the subtelties of puck control is, etc etc. When Worthington graduates a kid into D1, I'll be happier, than when 4 kids from elk river get D1 rides instead of 2.<br>Why, because that 1 kids from Worthington will get 20 more kids wanting to play D1 hockey instead of wrestling (we are the state of hockey aren't we?;-) And like baseball in the dominican republic, if every kid in MN played hockey, we'd have more diamonds in the rough, and all of a sudden a kids from marshall is playing D1. Then one from northfield.... then we get another Joel Otto from owatonna, because instead of focusing on the 50, we focused on the next 150.<br><br><br><!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr> but I overheard two Junior coaches discussing him once and they were not pleased with his attitude an<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br><br>...and if the elite program was worth it's salt, it would have addressed it. if you're just developing stats or press releases... you're only going half way. development can be in player character, player's team play, player's situational development, and 'off ice character'<br><br>elite means quality. elite means asset. either you are developing that asset or you're showing it off... the current program does the latter. I would suggest that the long term plan should really do the former.<br><br><!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>Pauer didnt "jump" to Juniors he went for a weekend to play while waiting his appeal to the high school league to be decided, I heard he is back in school in Orono now.<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br><br>Fair enough. It wasn't my fact. <br>and I don't know the facts of his reason for appeal. Let's just say, his HS hockey journey has had a lot of stops.<br><br>he's an elite, by the definition of the leauge.<br><br><!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>If it were not for the Elite league he would have been forced to go to juniors but stayed and fought the process in order to try and play high school. <hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br><br>that's an interesting twist... not tell me how the elite league helped? by providing him a place to practice? Provide legal representation? was he not allowed to go to captains practice? Hillen is playing in Junior Hockey... and he's playing at AHA this fall? tell me how Juniors couldn't have done the same for Pauer? Or some AAA team? I don't see the specific factual link. to me... it sounds like elites took him in before they realized he wasn't eligible to play HS hockey and you're trying to make lemonade from lemons.<br><br>(btw, I tend to side with the rules of the MHSHL)<br><br><!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>You seem bitter toward some of the gifted kids<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br><br>nope. I like gifted kids. I just don't like anointing them before they've earned it. I agree with Souix Fan... we can't just play these kids in an exhibition season and say we are doing them justice. We need to work them, put them into the paces of making them into great players... and work to back fill them at the 15's and 16's level. <br>Anything less and we are exploiting them. <br><br>Now... tell me about the fifty kids you feel aren't elite... why are they not the ones we should be focussing on. To me those are the ones... the not sure things...we need a program for. I really really really feel we can do those kids better than to consider them fodder for the fifty you want to focus on. Those are the kids that don't get the press, those are the kids that end up in bozeman or wichita unprepared and hoping to live the dream.<br><br>I truly feel the elite league doesn't do anything special for them. If you really want to get them to succeed, you go with the project prep model with the extensions as outlined by Souix fan.<br><br>The Fact is, For all it's faults, I accept the elite league for the kids. The kids need it. They need it to be better suited to prepare them, not to parade them like a bunch of jon benet ramsey's in a beauty pageant ("Objection! argumentative" "withdrawn").<br> <br><!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr> maybe you can end this thread on a positive note and name a POSTER boy? <hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END--><br><br> err... I thought I did.<br><br>how bout...<br><br>Andy Canzanello. Project Prep, and played HS soccer, and drove to GB to play Junior Hockey games, then played his senior year at Rochester Mayo. About to graduate from CC... senior defensive leader of the #6 team in the country.<br><br>Mike Lundin... played last year in a developmental team based in the south metro. was the iron man of the apple valley team. is now rotating into the starting line-up at the university of Maine. <br><br>both stayed in HS 4 years. graduated. Went to D1. Isn't that the dream of every MN kid. <br><br>(I didn't see a game or a practice of the elite program... I was going to name the kid from Como Park, but I don't know jack about him).<br><br>I'll ask you... name me the best forward in the elite program that came from a class A school south of Burnsville. Until we have a program where you can name 3 and state how they compare with this year's Mr Hockey candidates... you don't have a program that is good for the 'state of hockey(tm).' <p></p><i></i>

Dons
Posts: 101
Joined: Mon Oct 27, 2003 10:35 pm

Re: Elite League

Post by Dons » Mon Nov 24, 2003 12:17 am

holy crap dude...do you need a job?? i think you must be the one homeless person with a laptop..<br><br>i didnt even read all of it..i felt ashamed to know fellow citizens aer putting THIS much effort into Prep hockey..haha..hey someones gotta do it <p></p><i></i>

Sioux Fan
Posts: 552
Joined: Fri Aug 22, 2003 2:56 pm
Location: Rochester, MN

Re: Elite League

Post by Sioux Fan » Mon Nov 24, 2003 12:36 am

I think player development is the job that needs to be improved for our top players.<br><br>Duncan and Harrington are good players but they have had some struggles this year.<br><br>Struggles are good but I wish we would not surprise our guys with them and show them what and why they need to get better from 10th grade to 12th grade or whenever they move on to juniors.<br><br>I think we should have a program that gives the kids all the information and great practice sessions with the other best kids where they can learn to battle. <br><br>Also a thing that I always tell these young players is that you need to not rush yourself to a place where you lose your confidence. You need to maintain the positive attitude and continue to have success. This is where if a player is unprepared for the level of competition they go to they use a year of there career.<br><br>Once you push yourself off the edge of the developmental pyramid you are not able to easily get another chance to regroup...<br><br>This is why I am in favor of MN sponsoring a Midget major and minor program for our HS age players in the fall and spring with practice sessions at least 3 a week and 2 to 3 games a weekend...<br><br>Also we should have our own Junior program that keeps our 18 to 20 year olds in the state so we can finish the job. Who decided we needed to move to Kearney NE to make our players ready to play college hockey.. Why can't we do that here?<br><br>I think it is tough on coaches and young players to leave home from ages 15 to 17 and loose their confidence by being in a league with older players. I also liked Junior A hockey better when it was hungry guys who knew that they had two years to get good enough. I think that a player can easily get sick of Junior A hockey if the start too young and the colleges continue to wait for them to mature and get bigger and stronger while they work for slave labor camps they call the USHL... I know we can do better.. Who is with me? <p>Hockey Nut in So. MN</p><i></i>

atthepoint
Posts: 42
Joined: Sat Nov 15, 2003 8:04 pm

newbies

Post by atthepoint » Mon Nov 24, 2003 4:03 pm

Dons and other newbies on this site that just want to throw out snappy little quips, go back and read the rest of what bdabbt75 had to say. It was thoughtful and insightful, aside from the fact that I agree with him. <br><br>There are a few posters on this site that have built reputations for adding to the discussion. He is one of the tops of those. Feel free to make an intelligent rebuttal if you like, but don't show your ignorance by being dismissive.<br><br>I know this is probably just a rhetorical post as we frequently have new posters who want to come here and make noise, but this fall seems to be the worst in a couple of years. <p></p><i></i>

east hockey
Site Admin
Posts: 6964
Joined: Tue Dec 10, 2002 8:33 pm
Location: Proctor, MN
Contact:

Re: newbies

Post by east hockey » Mon Nov 24, 2003 4:59 pm

atthepoint, the "newbie noise" has been noted. IP addresses are being tracked. Mitch and I compare notes from time to time and take whatever actions we deem necessary. I've seen other Boards dissolve into nothing more than a sewer. That won't happen here.<br><br>Lee <p></p><i></i>

atthepoint
Posts: 42
Joined: Sat Nov 15, 2003 8:04 pm

noise

Post by atthepoint » Mon Nov 24, 2003 5:17 pm

You guys do a great job and we know it can be a handful. I was trying to give some free advice to those who might take some. <p></p><i></i>

Dons
Posts: 101
Joined: Mon Oct 27, 2003 10:35 pm

Re: noise

Post by Dons » Mon Nov 24, 2003 6:45 pm

i was a member last year too..my name just..i dont know..didnt carry over in teh summer..ha..newbie? all i said was that he wrote a 3 page reply. and thanks atthepoint..thank you to all the do-gooders <p></p><i></i>

2DaRink
Posts: 20
Joined: Mon Nov 24, 2003 7:02 pm

Elite Leaque

Post by 2DaRink » Mon Nov 24, 2003 7:02 pm

Josh Pauer had no choice but to look at Juniors after the Elite Tournament. Josh has used up his 4 year high school eligibility. He repeated the ninth grade and wanted nothing more than to stay at Orono for his senior year and graduate here in Minnesota. The Pauer's went before the State High School Leaque seeking permission for Josh to play this year. They were turned down, and if Josh wants to continue playing, Juniors seem to be his only choice. I wish Josh the best luck and wish he could of stayed in Minnesota. <p></p><i></i>

bdabbt75
Posts: 78
Joined: Tue Mar 05, 2002 12:04 pm

Re: Elite Leaque

Post by bdabbt75 » Mon Nov 24, 2003 9:57 pm

not the first kid it's happened to. Lourdes lost a very good player who transfered there but the previous school filed papers stating he was a varsity player when he repeated 8th grade, and he had attended 2 weeks of 9th grade, therefore officially was _in_ 9th grade. They appealed and they lost. <br><br>It sucked, but it's the rule. Otherwise, you'd have 'redshirting' in high school.<br><br>-bud <p></p><i></i>

inthecorners
Posts: 96
Joined: Thu Nov 06, 2003 12:21 am

eligibility

Post by inthecorners » Mon Nov 24, 2003 11:39 pm

If you have 4 years of eligibility, what is the maximum age a high school player can be? <br><br>If a student isn't making steady progress by having to repeat a grade, what happens to them? <br><br>How do suspensions effect a players eligibility?<br><br>Do the girls have to follow this same 4 year rule? (gender equity)<br> <p></p><i></i>

Locked